Angels, demons, devil, Sarah Palin and the Bible, are for real

  

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It is often also non surprising to me that people who are closed to be led by the Holy spirit, to Pentecostalism, peaking in  tongues seem to instead openly too prefer the demonic spirit of drunkenness.Why?

To some persons no other issue tends to divide the church and evoke as much deep seated emotion as the question of alcohol use as well , but only for the alcoholics now too, for in general,   clearly the issue of gay marriages, but note esepcially speaking in tongues, Baptism of the Holy Spirit, and Healing, gifts of the Holy spirit, impartation, cause more discussions and oppositions too, as the Anglican Church splits, and as the latests net exposes about the Todd Bentley Florida revival has clearly shown,

Do see also

http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/09/10/the-witchhunt-against-the-pentecostals-backfired/

http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/09/12/the-nomination-of-republican-vice-president-sarah-plain-has-certainly-sparked-interest/
http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/09/06/religious-topics-of-interest/
http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/08/26/disturbing-trend-sensationalized-religious-postings-bashings/
http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/07/05/laying-of-hands-impartation-breathe-of-the-spirit-anointings-anointed/
http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/06/13/what-is-the-general-christian-sentiment-towards-pentecostalism/
http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/07/12/bad-pastors-bad-d
http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/09/09/betrayers-of-jesus-christ/
http://groups.msn.com/HolySpiritCome

 

Survey of Bible Doctrine: Angels, Satan, Demons

By: Sid Litke , Th.M. (Bio)

The Doctrine of Angels

I. The Existence of Angels

  •  

      1. 34 books (of 66 total) refer to angels.

      2. Christ taught their existence (Matt.8:10; 24:31; 26:53 etc.).

      1. Angels were created by God (Ps.148:2,5; Col.1:16). Only God had no beginning (1 Tim.6:16).

      2. Angels were created before the world and man (Job 38:6,7).

      3. Angels were created holy (Ezek.28:15; Jude 6).

  • A.. The Bible assumes their existence.

    B. The Bible describes their creation.

II. The Nature of Angels

  •  

      1. They have intellect (Matt.28:5; 1 Pet.1:12).

      2. They have emotions (Job 38:7; Luke 2:13; 15:10)

      3. They have will (Jude 6).

    •  

        a. An angel can be in only one place at one time (Dan.9:21-23; 10:10-14)

        b. Although they are spirit beings, they can appear in the form of men (in dreams – Matt.1:20; in natural sight with human functions – Gen. 18:1-8; 22: 19:1; seen by some and not others – 2 Kings 6:15-17).

    • 1. They exist as spirits – not with material bodies (Heb. 1:14).

      2. They cannot reproduce (Mark 12:25).

      3. They do not die (Luke 20:36).

      1. They have more knowledge than man (Matt.24:31; Luke 1:13-16) but less than God (Matt.24:36).

      2. They have more power than man (2 Pet. 2:11; Acts 5:19) but less than God.

  • A. Angels are personal beings.

    B. Angels are spirit beings.

    C. Angels have communicable attributes in a degree greater than man but less than God.

    D. Angels are organized and ranked. One “archangel,” Michael is named (Jude 9). There are also “chief princes” (Dan.10:13), “seraphim” (Is.6:1-3) and “cherubim” (Gen.3:22-24).

III. The Ministries of Angels

    A. They worship God. Angels are continually involved in praising God (Rev.4:6-11) through describing His attributes (Is.6:3) and singing praises (Rev.5:8,9).

    B. They ministered to Christ. Angels announced His birth (Luke 1:26-33; 2:13), protected Him (Matt.2:13), strengthened Him (Matt.4:11; Luke 22:43), and explained to men His resurrection (Matt.28:6) and ascension (Acts 1:10,11).

    C. They carry out God’s government. Angels are God’s servants (Ps.103:20; Heb.1:7) and messengers (Luke 1:19; 2:8-14). They can be involved in controlling nature (Rev.7:1; 16:3,8,9), nations (2 Kings 19:35), and Satan and demons (Dan.10:13,21; 12:1). They will perform future judgment for God (Matt.13:3a; Rev.15:1; 16:1-21).

    D. They protect God’s people. Angels are sent to serve believers (Heb.1:14). They protect the godly (Ps.34:7; Dan.6:20,23), oppose our enemies (Ps.35:4,5) and are specifically assigned as guardians of individuals (Matt.18:10). They are God’s agents in answering prayer (Acts 12:7) even bringing physical provisions (Gen.21:17-20; 1 Kings 19:5-7).

    E. They assist believers at death (Luke 16:22; Jude 9).

The Doctrine of Satan

I. The Existence of Satan

    A. Seven Old Testament books and every New Testament writer refer to Satan.

    B. Jesus referred to Satan (Matt.13:39; Luke 10:18; 11:18).

II. The Personality and Names of Satan

    A. Personality – He has intellect (2 Cor.11:3), emotions (Rev.12:17) and will (2 Tim.2:26.

    B. Names – He is called Satan, the Devil (slanderer), Lucifer (son of the morning), Beelzebub (Lord of the flies – Matt.12:24), and Belial (lawless – 2 Cor.6:15), the evil one (1 John 5:19), the tempter (1 Thess.3:5), the prince of this world (John 12:31), the god of this age (2 Cor.4:4), the prince of the power of the air (Eph.2:2), the accuser of the brethren (Rev.12:10), and angel of light (false light – 2 Cor.11:14), a serpent (Rev.12:9), and a dragon (Rev.12:3).

III. The Nature of Satan

    A. He is a created angelic being. He was created as part of the angelic realm (Eph.6:11,12; Ezek.24:18) and was the highest in rank of them all (Ezek.28:12-14).

    B. He is an enemy of righteousness. He is a murderer (John 8:44), a liar (John 8:44), and accuser (Rev.12:10) and our adversary (1 Pet.5:8).

    C. He is a limited creature. He is limited by God (Job.1:12). He is not God’s equal (1 John 4:4). He is not omniscient, omnipotent or infinite in any way. Believers with God’s help can resist him (James 4:7).

IV. The Fall of Satan

  •  
    •  

        a. Cast out of the mountain of God (v.16, cf. Rev. 12:4)

        b. Cast to the ground (v.17)

        c. Consumed by fire (v.18, cf. Rev.20:10)

    • 1. His privileges – Free access to the garden of Eden (v.12) and to God’s holy mountain (= God’s presence – v.14)

      2. His rank – “Cherub” (vs.14,16)

      3. His judgment –

      1. The imagery of a “star” and “falling from heaven” (v.12) suggests a supernatural fulfillment. “Stars” (v.12,13) are symbolic of the angelic realm elsewhere (Job 38:6,7; Rev.12:4).

      2. The five “I will’s” of vss. 13 & 14 are literally true of Satan and only metaphorically true of Babylon’s king. This ultimate form of pride (“I will be like the Most High” – v.14) fits the New Testament description of Satan’s fall 1 Tim.3:6.

  • Key Passages – Ezekiel 28; Isaiah 14

    A. Ezekiel 28:11-19 is a prophetic lamentation over the “King of Tyre” who is described in language that fits Satan’s fall and not a mere human king. Satan is distinguished form the human ruler of Tyre in 28:2 (“prince/ruler”) and called a “king” in 28:12 (Not even Israel’s rulers were called “King”). Though Tyre had a human “ruler”, Satan was the real “King” behind that wicked kingdom.

    B. His attributes – Moral perfection (v.12) Sinless at his creation until his fall (v.15)

    C. His appearance – Perfect in beauty (v.12b,13)

    D. Isaiah 14:12-15 also seems to describe Satan’s fall. Satan is manifest here by the king of Babylon. As in Ezekiel 28, Satan is pictured here as the real “king” behind the wicked human kingdom of Babylon.

V. The Activity of Satan

    Satan is seeking to oppose God’s plan by promoting evil in every way possible.

    A. Indirect Activity – He works indirectly through the world (in which he has great freedom and power – John 12:31; 1 John 5:19) and the flesh (Gal.5:19-21). The world, the flesh and the devil are not three separate enemies of the Christian. Rather Satan works through the evil world system (1 John 2:13-15) to exploit the fleshly nature that still wars within us (Rom.7:18; Gal.5:19-21).

 

 

  •  
    •  

        a. He tempted Christ (Matt.4:1-11).

        b. He attempted to thwart Christ’s work (John 8:44; Matt.16:23; Luke 22:31).

        c. He possessed Judas to accomplish the betrayal (John 13:27).

        a. He blinds their minds to hinder their understanding of the gospel (2 Cor.4:4).

        b. When the gospel is heard or understood, he tries to hinder its effect (Luke 8:12).

        c. He uses persecution (Rev.2:10) and false religions (Rev.2:13) to hinder the effect of the gospel.

        a. He tempts believers (to pride – 1 Chron.21:1-8; to materialism – John 2:15; James 5:1-7; to immorality – 1 Cor.7:5; to lie – Acts 5:3; to discouragement – 1 Pet.5:6-10; to be unforgiving – 2 Cor.2:10,11 etc.).

        b. He hinders the ministries of believers (1 Thess.2:18; Rev.2:10).

        c. He promotes false teaching among believers (1 John 4:1-4).

        d. He promotes anger, bitterness and division (Eph.4:26,27; 2 Cor.2:5-11). Note: See the supplement – “Satanic Activity and Spiritual Warfare” for more information on how Satan and his demons work and how we must respond.

    • 1. In Christ’s ministry

      2. In unbelievers

      3. In believers

  • B. Direct Activity – He works directly by deception, temptation, attack and possession.

The Doctrine of Demons

I. The Existence and Nature of Demons

  •  

      1. The evidence – It is clear that Satan has a following of like beings (“Prince of the demons” – Matt.12:24; the Devil and his angels – Matt.25:41). Demons are described throughout the Scriptures (Dan.10:10-20; Matt.10:1; Eph.6:12).

      2. The time – At the fall of Satan, many angels followed him in that rebellion (demons are fallen angels). A third of the angelic host seem to have fallen with Satan (Rev.12:4 – the imagery of Satan as a “dragon” and angels/demons as “stars”).

    •  

        a. They are deceitful (1 Tim.4:1-3; 2 Cor.11:13-15).

        b. They are immoral (Gen.6:4; Jude 6,7).

    • 1. Demons are by nature the same kind of spirit beings as angels. They are personal, intelligent beings.

      2. Demons are morally wicked (“unclean spirits” – Matt.10:1; “evil” – Luke 7:21; “wickedness/darkness” – Eph.6:12).

      3. Demons are invisible but also able to appear (Satan – Zech.3:1; Matt.4:9.10; Demons – Rev.9:7-10; 16:13-16).

      4. Demons have great intelligence. They knew Christ’s identity and power (Mark 1:14,34; 5:6,7). They know their own future judgment (Matt.8:28,29). They can attempt to predict the future (Acts 16:16). They’re knowledge is not infinite. They learned it through thousands of years of experience and observation.

      5. Demons have great strength (Mark 5:3; Acts 19:16; Rev.9:1-11).

  • A. Their Creation – God created demons as part of the angelic realm originally (Col.1:16).

    B. Their Fall –

    C. Their Nature –

II. The Activity of Demons

  •  

      1. They cause physical ailments (dumbness – Matt.9:32,33; blindness – Matt.12:22; convulsions – Matt.17:15-18; Mark 9:20; self-injury – Mark 5:5; 9:22).

      2. They cause mental disorders (withdrawal, nudity, filth, irrational behavior – Luke 8:27-29; suicidal mania – Mark 9:22).

      3. They inflict problems upon believers as well, if allowed by God (Job’s troubles – Job 2:7-9; Paul’s “thorn in the flesh”: – 2 Cor. 12:7).

  • Demons are involved in carrying out Satan’s evil plans (2 Cor.11:15). What Satan is said to be doing (see above) is their work directly.

    A. Demons promote idolatry (Lev.17:7; Deut.32:17; Ps.106:36-38). This activity is blatant in primitive cultures.

    B. Demons are active in hindering the spiritual progress of believers every way they can (see Satan’s activities). They are deliberate and organized in these attempts (Eph.6:10-12).

    C. Demons promote false teaching (1 Tim.4:1).

    D. Demons can possess and afflict people (see supplement).

    E. Demons promote selfishness and division in the church (James 3:13-16).

Recommended Reading and References

Fred Dickason, Angels, Elect and Evil. Chicago: Moody Press, 1975.

http://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=388

  

anyone who does not believe that evil sprits exists clearly are very self revealing, they do show more about themselves even as to how spiritual, and morally ignorant they themselves now are.. so now in desperation they have to falsely bash Sarah Palin , who rightfully believes in Jesus Christ, Evil Spirt, the bad witches too, to falsely try to deny, cover up their own ignorance, lack of spirituality and morality still . But it is a futile, vain approach, for they themselves have been spotted as to who they really now are.. and what they unacceptably try to do.. falsely ABUSE OTHERS NEXT TOO.

Do see also

http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/10/04/sarah-palin-said-barack-obama-off-base/

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“Why Canada’s Prime Minister Stephen Harper keeps his religion secret ?”

about the False Teachers & Disobedient Christians

Toronto Airport Christian Fellowship Church Pentecostal Dispute

Bell Sympatico

Basic Contract law

and more false cover ups

Unbelievable! The internet control freaks, false spin doctors..

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This next was so predictable even by me too

  The Bell company has also adopted rebranded its Bell ExpressVu, Sympatico and residential service in favour of Bell TV, Bell Internet and Bell Home Phone.  http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2009/08/07/bell-bce-own-profitability/

The new image will not deny the same bad Bell  http://canadatoday9.multiply.com/journal/item/4/HOW_TO_DEAL_WITH_MAJOR_COMPLAINTS

“It’s all to convince to convey that Bell is and has gotten better,” Bell Mobility president Wade Oosterman said in an interview.

But telecom analyst Carmi Levy of AR Communications said the changes will have little impact unless they are accompanied by a dramatic improvement to customer service.

“You can change your logo and you can change the name of your offering until the cows come home but if you don’t change the fundamental way that you operate, then the rebranding effort will be for not,” the Toronto-based analyst said in an interview.

He said Bell needs to be less adversarial and aggressive with customers and more responsive to their needs.

“This needs to be just the first salvo in an ongoing effort to become a softer friendlier company to deal with.”

New Bell chief executive George Cope has promised to improve customer service as it completely overhauls the vast business. The Montreal-based company recently announced plans to shed 15 per cent of management and sell non-core assets.

Bell hangs up on 2500 jobs
Toronto Starall 199 news articles »  En Français »

   Analysts say there’s more bloodletting ahead at telecom giant Bell Canada following news yesterday the company is axing 2500 managers .  – BCE Inc.’s newly appointed chief executive George Cope announced the company will shed 2,500 management positions representing several layers of bureaucracy as the first steps of a plan designed to steer the bloated telecommunication giant back into competitive shape. The layoffs, which include the reduction of 15 per cent of BCE’s management and 30 per cent of its senior leadership team, will be focused in the company’s main business units such as its Bell Canada, Mobility, ExpressVu and Enterprise groups, Cope said. Non-management front-line service positions are not affected by the announcement, although it is expected some of its 54,000-strong workforce will be cut by the end of the year.

 I have written a lot even on the net  in  the last 18 months how bad Bell really has become.. http://www.google.com/search?q=thenonconformer+sympatico&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&startIndex=&startPage=1 

http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2008/07/18/bell-sympatico-executive-care-sasha-rollins/ 

 

 

If you’re sgned up with a locked in agreement with either carrier, and have selected your desired plan option, the Quebec man is arguing that the carrier is not permitted to change the terms of said plan until the contract has ended. 
 
 
Where’s Canada’s regulator? Globe and Mail, Canada –  Coincidentally, this morning also brought news that a class-action lawsuit has been launched in Quebec over plans by Bell Mobility Inc. and Telus …
  
 
Bell Canada Ontario class action  p2pnet.net, Canada – 22 Jul 2008 Says Drake in a p2pnet Reader’s Write, “Ontario residents can now join the class action suit against Bell for throttling.” Bell Canada has been trying to …
 
  
 the Canadian Internet Policy and Public Interest Clinic, based at the University of Ottawa’s Faculty of Law, asked the federal Privacy Commissioner to investigate the Internet service provider (ISP) industry’s practice of profiling users online to target them with advertising… You’d think the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission would have stepped into that role a little more energetically than it has. It seems to have been loath to delve too far into holding high-tech companies accountable to any standards.  The CRTC’s U.S. counterpart, the Federal Communications Commission, is a much more aggressive regulator (in a land obsessed with deregulation). This morning the FCC took a step closer to “punishing” Comcast after the company had blocked Internet traffic among users of file-sharing software that allows them to exchange large amounts of data. Though the punishment is not likely to include a fine, it could require Comcast to stop blocking peer-to-peer traffic, open up their business to the FCC describing what exactly Comcast had done and to be a lot more transparent with its customers about how it manages its network… Why do practices like these have to be handled by individuals launching lawsuits or self-appointed law clinics writing stiff letters? Why are our regulators quiet while the service providers, of both Internet and cellphone services, keep charging whatever they want and doing things that they wouldn’t do if they were more actively regulated? It’s not like Canadian Internet providers have been angels, living just above the poverty line. But it appears they have been milking their customers, and should be accountable for their actions.
  
Ottawa sends own message on new cellphone fees
Toronto Star,  Canada – 5 hours ago
He said that, as of yesterday, 270 people had signed up for the lawsuit against Telus and another 306 for the suit against Bell. …
Ontarians join anti-text fee lawsuit Toronto Sun
Class-action sought over messaging fees Globe and Mail
SMS Alert: Class Action Suit Filed Against Bell, Telus MarketnewsGadgetTalk
Prepaid Reviews – TheChronicleHerald.ca
all 192 news articles »
 
Class Action Lawsuit Launched Against Telus and Bell
Mobile Magazine – 28 Jul 2008
In fact, the Canadian populace is so angry at Telus and Bell that they are launching a class action lawsuit over the incoming text message fee. …
Class action suit filed against Bell, Telus for new texting fees CBC.ca
Bell, Telus facing possible lawsuits over text fees CJAD
Bell and Telus sued over incoming text fees Winnipeg Sun
CTV.ca – Canoe.ca
all 104 news articles »
    
I do not have to accept any of the negative consequences, or bad acts of other persons  and their sins too. Not even those by the Liberals or the Conservatives leaders now too.
That includes their verbal abuse, physical abuse, slander, lies, emotional abuses, their false silent treatment too now. etc.. I can even tell them that now too. 

Public exposure and prosecution of the guilty persons seems to be most effective way that works for everyone’s benefit in dealing with the bad acts of others still.

(Job 28:28 KJV)  And unto man he said, Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom; and to depart from evil is understanding.

I still am often amazed how many control freaks I do encounter, and yes often they can also be found in schools, homes, work, church,  governments, elsewhere too.. these are people who often claim they are giving you some helpful hints, tips, advice but are trying to manipulate you to do something they rather want.  
 
Control freaks do often have a terrible personal, social  life too and do often make all life terrible for those they live with, marry, work with, come in contact with.
   
Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2008 11:29 AM
Cc: correspondenceminister ; mpremier@gov.ab.ca ; premier@gov.bc.ca ; premier@leg.gov.mb.ca ; Premier@gnb.ca ; premier@gov.nl.ca ; floyd_roland@gov.nt.ca ; premier@gov.ns.ca ; rwjghiz@gov.pe.ca ; premier@gov.sk.ca ; dennis.fentie@gov.yk.ca ; compbureau@cb-bc.gc.ca ; info@ccts-cprst.ca ; infomgs@mgs.gov.on.ca ; ccbbb@canadiancouncilbbb.ca ; pm41 ; Nicholson.R@parl.gc.ca ; Day.S@parl.gc.ca ; Dion.S@parl.gc.ca ; Abbott.J@parl.gc.ca ; allenm@parl.gc.ca ; Ambrose.R@parl.gc.ca ; Anders.R@parl.gc.ca ; Baird.J@parl.gc.ca ; Bell.D@parl.gc.ca ; Bernier.M@parl.gc.ca ; Blackburn.J@parl.gc.ca ; Cannon.L@parl.gc.ca ; casson@rickcasson.com ; Chong.M@parl.gc.ca ; Clement.T@parl.gc.ca ; davebatters@shaw.ca ; Davidp@parl.gc.ca ; delmad@parl.gc.ca ; DevolB@parl.gc.ca ; Emerson.D@parl.gc.ca ; FailleM ; Finley.D@parl.gc.ca ; Flaherty.J@parl.gc.ca ; Fletcher.S@parl.gc.ca ; Goodale.R@parl.gc.ca ; hawnL@parl.gc.ca ; Hearn.L@parl.gc.ca ; Holland.M@parl.gc.ca ; info@dickharrismp.ca ; jaffer@parl.gc.ca ; Keeper.T@parl.gc.ca ; Kenney.J@parl.gc.ca ; Layton.J@parl.gc.ca ; Lukiwski.T@parl.gc.ca ; Lunn.G@parl.gc.ca ; Mackay.P@parl.gc.ca ; MacKenzie.D@parl.gc.ca ; martin.paul@parl.gc.ca ; mathyi@parl.gc.ca ; Mayes.C@parl.gc.ca ; Moore.J@parl.gc.ca ; Obhrai.D@parl.gc.ca ; OConnor.G@parl.gc.ca ; Oda.B@parl.gc.ca ; ottawa@larrymiller.ca ; Pallister.B@parl.gc.ca ; pepinl@sen.parl.gc.ca ; Prentice.J@parl.gc.ca ; rajotte.j@parl.gc.ca ; sgroj@parl.gc.ca ; silva.m@parl.gc.ca ; simmssc@parl.gc.ca ; Skelton.C@parl.gc.ca ; Solberg.M@parl.gc.ca ; sorenson.k@parl.gc.ca ; Toews.V@parl.gc.ca ; Verner.J@parl.gc.ca ; volpej1@parl.gc.ca ; warkentin.c@parl.gc.ca ; Yelich.L@parl.gc.ca ; zedp@parl.gc.ca ; letters@cbc.ca ; news@ctv.ca ; newsroom@herald.ca ; newsdesk@lfpress.com ; submit@theherald.canwest.com ; letters@thegazette.canwest.com ; localnews@tc.canwest.com ; sunnewstips@png.canwest.com ; city@thejournal.canwest.com ; globalnews.reg@globaltv.ca ; mmarshall@leaderpost.canwest.com ; tabtips@png.canwest.com ; sanderson@thecitizen.canwest.com ; newsroom@canadianchristianity.com ; ministre@finances.gouv.qc.ca ; ministre@justice.gouv.qc.ca ; Letters@globeandmail.com
Subject: : Bell
I have received today your illegal, unsigned Bell  letter to me dated July 24, 2008  Subject account Number 48180409 COLLECTION AGENCY ACTION PENDING 
  
 Unless you in  full and adequately answer all of my past 300 letters of complaint to you, you are again warned any other further actions by Bell  towards me will be taken as personal harassment of me, and they not only will be fully exposed to all on the net too, but  I will call the police, the RCMP as well and rightfully have  you charged with harassment.
 
Paul Kambulow
Bell continues to cheat, lie, steal, abuse..
     
50 Cent Files Taco Bell Lawsuit
Artistdirect.com, CA – 25 Jul 2008
50 Cent’s legal team has filed a lawsuit against Taco Bell, saying he never agreed to endorse their value menu. In a recent commercial, the company suggests …
50 Cent says Taco Bell stole his endorsement Reuters
UPDATE: Rapper 50 Cent Sues Taco Bell Over Name-Change Letter CNNMoney.com
50 Cent sues Taco Bell over ad campaign The Associated Press
E! Online – MTV.com
all 669 news articles »
 
Posted on the net too.
 related posts:
Class action suit filed against Bell, Telus for new texting fees
CBC.ca, Canada – 23 hours ago
Eric Cormier, who has subscribed to Bell Mobility for the past decade, says by introducing the new fees, the companies have changed the terms of their cellular contracts.”This was something that was free up until then and the problem for the consumers is that they cannot re-negotiate the contract,” said lawyer Noel Saint-Pierre.

“What we’re trying to get the court to say is that for the duration of a contract … the telephone company should not be able to unilaterally modify the conditions of the contract.” as e-mail and MMS continue to gain popularity among phone users, undoubtedly resulting in increased revenues for carriers, Bell and Telus decide to nickel and dime the occassional users.