All posts tagged Judaism

Many tend to have a false, selective view of Christian History

Amongst another one of those big false, lies is“ If in the past many supposed that any substantial attachment by Christians to the observance of Jewish customs essentially vanished after the first generation of Jewish followers of Jesus passed away, it is now conceivable that many Christians remained open and even committed to observing the Torah after 70 CE—the year when the Temple of Jerusalem was destroyed by the Romans.”

For as far as Judaism, Israel, this is what is said in the New Testament.

Matthew 23

38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Luke 13

35 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

Acts 1

20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.

Galatians 4

27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband

https://witnessed.wordpress.com/2015/03/30/desolate/

Lies and distortions, taking isolated Bible verses out of context, are major part of the Jewish interpretation of Christianity, and of Jesus , Apostle Paul, and all Christian teachings.. even by the Messianic Jews and most Jews, Muslims even, they do not worship the same God as the Christians do cause they had rejected Jesus Christ as their God.

Many Jews do view Gentiles, Christians still as morally impure because they engage in the other practices, teachings that were deemed immoral by Jewish standards.

The Gospel of Matthew by the Jews is referred to as the “most Jewish” gospel of the New Testament, while Luke-Acts, Apostle Paul’s writings are viewed as merely a Gentile Christian text, or very much less Jewish in other words.

No Jews or non Jews never the less should still continue to observe the Torah after embracing Jesus as their Messiah.

The Christian Church is not defined solely by the 4 Gospel of Matthew, Luke and John but is also clearly more defined by the Book of Acts and Apostle Paul’s writings.

Matthew 28:19–20, which appears only in Matthew: “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything that I have commanded you.” Does not include the Torah , or the Noahide laws. Noahide Laws. This false rabbinic teaching posits that Gentiles need not observe the 613 commandments of the Torah but only abide by seven universal, ethical laws.

Jesus was responsible for the cessation of the Jewish religious practices. Jesus was the first “Christian,” who had come to announce the end of the Torah and Judaism, of Israel as well. Jesus simply came to fulfill Messianic prophecies contained in the Jewish scriptures, and not to Continue his once Jewishness.

Still the Apostle Paul is falsely accused of Draining Jesus of his Jewishness and the false “Blame” for the Christian distancing from Jewish practice has centered around Paul, the apostle of the Gentiles traditionally. Paul by the Jews is viewed as an “apostate” from Judaism who rather had founded a new religion, Christianity. In reality the observance of Jewish customs essentially vanished after the first generation of Jewish, Gentile Christian followers of Jesus passed away, especially after 70 CE—the year when the Temple of Jerusalem was destroyed by the God and Romans.

The Jewishness of Jesus has been gradually resurfacing mainly in North America mainly and is contrasted by the Views held by European Christians. American Christians tend to conceive of their faith in Jewish terms and even falsely identify themselves with the Jewish people and story significantly a lot more over the Europeans Christians..

https://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2014/08/01/invaded/

“For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven” (Matt 5:20). And elsewhere, Matthew stresses Jesus statements on the the importance of the Jews in keeping firstly the “moral” or “ethical” requirements of the Torah over their merely keeping the “ritual” commandments of the Jewish Law. The moral or ethical laws dictate how humans should relate to one another. Ritual commandments, on the other hand, refer to those laws that are meant to set the Jews aside as the chosen people to serve their God which had in he past included such things as the observance of the Sabbath, festivals, circumcision, as well as certain purity and dietary laws and all of which still are not binding on any Christians. Matthew’s Jewish Jesus accuses the Pharisees for neglecting the practice of ethics by focusing on the ritual: “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you tithe mint, dill, and cummin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faith. It is these you ought to have practiced without neglecting the others” (23:23). Matthew uses the term “weightier matters of the law” to describe the moral commandments of keeping justice, mercy, and faith. The Pharisees focused more on fulfilling “lighter,” ritual commandments such as tithing herbs It is clear in Luke-Acts that Gentile Christians are not expected to observe the Torah in its entirety. Acts makes this point clear by decreeing that Gentile (male) followers of Jesus do not need to be circumcised but need to “abstain only from things polluted by idols and from fornication and from whatever has been strangled and from blood” (15:20).

While there are no statements in the gospel of Luke any more than in Matthew that abrogate the observance of dietary laws for Jews all real Christians next, now are free to eat pork, lobster, or any other animal forbidden for Jewish consumption by the Mosaic Torah (Leviticus 11/Deuteronomy 14).

Acts chs. 10–11, rather, many readers of Luke-Acts did all gather rightfully to proclaim the end of Jewish dietary laws. Apostle Peter, one of the main disciples of Jesus in Acts, learns this lesson through a vision in which he sees all kinds of “four-footed creatures and reptiles and birds of the air” lowered from the sky on a sheet (10:11–12). Three times a heavenly voice commands him to slaughter and eat the animals in front of him, but Peter adamantly refuses, claiming that he has “never eaten anything that is profane or unclean” (10:14). The heavenly voice responds that “what God has made clean, you must not call profane” (10:15). Now this statement literally announces the obvious application of the vision, namely, that all animals are now kosher and permissible for consumption.

Luke 16:16: “The law and the prophets were in effect until John came; since then the good news of the kingdom of God is proclaimed, and everyone tries to enter it by force.” Thus the proclamation of the good news of the kingdom of God marks a new phase in Jewish history, which is Christianity. The kingdom of God is proclaimed in Luke-Acts at the expense of the Jews, Jewish Torah.

No Jewish person in Acts embraces more the past perpetuation of Torah observance like Apostle Paul. Paul had attended the synagogue on the Sabbath (13:14–15; 14:1, etc.), kept the Jewish festivals such as Shavuot/Pentecost (20:16) and Yom Kippur (27:9), went to the temple in Jerusalem and had partaken in its rituals (21:24), affirms his past fidelity to the Torah and Jewish customs (28:17), and even circumcises Timothy (16:3)! And yet he too next had gave it all up to be a follower solely of Jesus Christ .

Personal Salvation, for all by Jesus Christ is achieved without observing the precepts of the Torah that had exclusively applied only to the Jewish people and which laws they were never able to keep in full as well. So why would they want to put Christians under these false bondages?

Even these days Jews and Messianic Jews tend to have a false, selective view of Christianity, History

Jews, Messianic Jews blame Christians, Gentiles for their hardships, sufferings. “It is an aggressive , war like stance in the debate over the Jewish history,” where both groups have been distorting the past of their history. “History is a victim of the current crisis in relations between Jews and and Christianity . The whole question is how much hard evidence does anyone really have to support their too often one sided presentations is asked. No one knows what Jewish life was even at the time of Christ even cause the Romans had destroyed the Jewish books and Libraries.. “ The Jews do want everyone to think that everyone else wise is in the wrong, abusive, corrupt, influenced.” Selective memory, false Biblical studies, “wars of historical memory” are being waged by the Jews with the Christians, Gentiles where History is increasingly being interpreted in different ways to suit their own personal Jewish views . Any negative statements that comes about as to the Jews is now still being falsely viewed as being anti Semitic, as Gentile Genocide with the “intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or the whole Jewish religious group,” and not necessarily by killing them, but also by any opposition of the PAST Jewish acts, writing, history.

Luke-Acts still remind us that the ex Jewish and Gentile followers of Jesus both had played a prominent role in early Christian history, even after the destruction of the Temple in 70 CE, when all Christians, now non Jewish ones too were becoming the dominant force and voice within Christianity.

In reality many of the early History of Christian works, those the church fathers wrote or preached from the pulpit have been preserved and they were mostly opposed to Judaism and the observance of Jewish custom. . As late as the fourth century of the Common Era, John Chrysostom, was vociferously convincing his Christian parishioners in Antioch not to attend services at synagogues and not to observe Jewish festivals .

No Jews or non Jews should continue to observe the Torah especially after embracing Jesus as their Messiah.

Today’s Apostolic leaders bring another challenge of the false Christian Zionists who have made a “deal with the devil” in accepting Messianic Christian Zionism..

Desolate

Of all the words of Jesus recorded in the Bible, about twenty-five percent of his teaching was devoted to prophecy concerning the destruction of Jerusalem, the scattering of the Jewish people worldwide, and the end of the world. Instead of listening to the lies of mere men and demons do read Jesus’ words in their entirety, in the Bible itself firstly. Not one Bible Prophecies Endorses Israel’s present Behavior, land conquests. The nation of Israel was blessed when it obeyed God’s instructions, and it was next cursed when it disobeyed. The context of Jesus’ Olivet Discourse was about the pending desolation of Jerusalem and the Jews, and NOT about even the Gentile end times.

In Matthew chapter 23 Jesus was addressing the Pharisees. He called down “woes” upon them: “Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!” because they shut up the kingdom of heaven (vs. 13), because they devour widows’ houses (vs. 14), because they make disciples for hell (vs. 15), because they elevate gold above the temple (vss. 16-22), because they engage in nit picking while neglecting the weightier matters of the law (vss. 23-24), and because they appear outwardly clean but are inwardly corrupt (vss. 25-33). He then reminded the Pharisees that they are “the sons of them who killed the prophets” and called them “ye generation of vipers.” (vs. 31, 33) After foretelling that they would persecute and kill his disciples the same way their fathers killed the prophets, “that upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zechariah, son of Barachiah,” Jesus concluded with the sentence above: “Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.” Clearly this was the generation that stood there in Jesus’ presence, the generation he was addressing in person. The punishment for their hypocrisy and their wickedness would come upon that very generation. Note Jesus’ pronouncement to the same Jewish religious leaders that “your house is left unto you desolate” (Matt. 23:38 KJV)

In Matthew 23, Jesus condemned the Scribes and Pharisees and told them that all of the righteous blood that they had shed would come on them.

“Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers’ guilt. Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell?

Therefore, indeed, I send you prophets, wise men, and scribes: some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from city to city, that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. Assuredly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.

Luke 19:41-44, Jesus and His disciples approached Jerusalem and He told them that the Jews enemies would surround them, and level them and the temple. “Now as He drew near, He saw the city and wept over it, saying, “If you had known, even you, especially in this your day, the things that make for your peace! But now they are hidden from your eyes. For days will come upon you when your enemies will build an embankment around you, surround you and close you in on every side, and level you, and your children within you, to the ground; and they will not leave in you one stone upon another, because you did not know the time of your visitation.”

Matthew 22:1-7 says, “And Jesus answered and spoke to them again by parables and said: “The kingdom of heaven is like a certain king who arranged a marriage for his son, and sent out his servants to call those who were invited to the wedding; and they were not willing to come. Again, he sent out other servants, saying, ‘Tell those who are invited, “See, I have prepared my dinner; my oxen and fatted cattle are killed, and all things are ready. Come to the wedding.” ‘ But they made light of it and went their ways, one to his own farm, another to his business. And the rest seized his servants, treated them spitefully, and killed them. But when the king heard about it, he was furious. And he sent out his armies, destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.”

Because of the Jews abominations against God, He made them desolate. Because of all of the Jews abominations, including delivering Jesus up to be killed, and then killing His disciples, Jesus poured out His wrath on the Jews, through the Roman army. A total of 1.1 million Jews died, and 97,000 Jews were taken captive and sold as slaves.

Too many demon led Christian evangelicals, led by their false Zionist theology still falsely are helping the Jews conquer the Middle East.and falsely view it as their Christian duty to assist the Israelis to kill and subjugate the Arab and Palestinian peoples.. They lie that “God needs an earthly temple in Jerusalem,” say Jewish Zionist and Gentile Judaizers; he requires a “house” and a throne here on this planet. The Zionists and Judaizers claim that Christians also need a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem, a holy place where Christians can celebrate Jewish feast days, sacrifice animals, and carry out Old Covenant Jewish rituals and ceremonies. Jews and Christian evangelicals (Judaizers) are eager to establish their own worldly version of the “Kingdom of God.” They are scheming and plotting to rebuild the ancient Jewish temple on the Temple Mount in Jerusalem. And anyone who dares suggest they are going in the wrong direction, is falsely labelled by them as an anti-Semitic Jew-hater. Corrupted Jews, with all their excess human pride. They fancy themselves God’s Chosen People and imagine that their earthly city, Jerusalem, and their earthly kingdom, Israel, is where God seeks to dwell forever. They really think falsely that the Messiah will inhabit a Jewish flesh-and-blood body and sit on a throne built by human hands. But Jesus prophesied that earthly Jerusalem would be destroyed and the temple thrown down stone by stone. And so it was, in 70 AD. Revelation 11:7-8 says that Jerusalem, the Great City, wherein our Lord was crucified, is spiritually “Sodom and Egypt.” Think of it! Christian Zionists, Jews disregarding everything that God said and did, are still obsessed and consumed as they vainly pull out all stops to build here on earth a modern-day Jewish version of “Sodom and Egypt.” but still God hates their pride, Idolatry, divorce so God’s judgement against Israel remains so “Jesus has taken the Kingdom of God from you and given it to another nation bringing forth fruits?” Matthew 21:43

23:37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling. 38″Behold, your house is being left to you desolate! 39″For I say to you, from now on you will not see Me until you say, ‘BLESSED IS HE WHO COMES IN THE NAME OF THE LORD!'”

Isaiah 13:9
See, the day of the LORD is coming –a cruel day, with wrath and fierce anger– to make the land desolate and destroy the sinners within it.

Malachi 4:1
“Surely the day is coming; it will burn like a furnace. All the arrogant and every evildoer will be stubble, and the day that is coming will set them on fire,” says the LORD Almighty. “Not a root or a branch will be left to them.

Isaiah 2:12 For the day of the LORD of hosts shall be on every one that is proud …

1 Kings 9:7
then I will cut off Israel from the land I have given them and will reject this temple I have consecrated for my Name. Israel will then become a byword and an object of ridicule among all peoples.

Psalm 69:25
May their place be deserted; let there be no one to dwell in their tents.

Isaiah 5:9
The LORD Almighty has declared in my hearing: “Surely the great houses will become desolate, the fine mansions left without occupants.

Jeremiah 22:5
But if you do not obey these commands, declares the LORD, I swear by myself that this palace will become a ruin.'”

Zephaniah 3:6
“I have destroyed nations; their strongholds are demolished. I have left their streets deserted, with no one passing through. Their cities are laid waste; they are deserted and empty.

Jeremiah 7:8″Behold, you are trusting in deceptive words to no avail. 9″Will you steal, murder, and commit adultery and swear falsely, and offer sacrifices to Baal and walk after other gods that you have not known, 10then come and stand before Me in this house, which is called by My name, and say, ‘We are delivered!’– that you may do all these abominations?…

Isaiah 1:13
Stop bringing meaningless offerings! Your incense is detestable to me. New Moons, Sabbaths and convocations– I cannot bear your worthless assemblies.

Jeremiah 1:16
I will pronounce my judgments on my people because of their wickedness in forsaking me, in burning incense to other gods and in worshiping what their hands have made.

Jeremiah 11:17T he LORD Almighty, who planted you, has decreed disaster for you, because the people of both Israel and Judah have done evil and aroused my anger by burning incense to Baal.

Jeremiah 19:4
For they have forsaken me and made this a place of foreign gods; they have burned incense in it to gods that neither they nor their ancestors nor the kings of Judah ever knew, and they have filled this place with the blood of the innocent.

Ezekiel 5:11 Therefore as surely as I live, declares the Sovereign LORD, because you have defiled my sanctuary with all your vile images and detestable practices, I myself will shave you; I will not look on you with pity or spare you.

Malachi 3:5 “So I will come to put you on trial. I will be quick to testify against sorcerers, adulterers and perjurers, against those who defraud laborers of their wages, who oppress the widows and the fatherless, and deprive the foreigners among you of justice, but do not fear me,” says the LORD Almighty.

Jesus, in the Synoptic Gospels, went to a fig tree looking for food to eat (Matthew 21:18-22; Mark 11:12-14, 20-21). When he saw that there were no figs on the tree he cursed it. There is a very reasonable explanation why Jesus cursed the fig tree . Jesus cursing of the fig tree is a played or acted out parable, one which warned the nation of Israel of it’s impending final judgment. ‘The time of the fig is not yet,’ says Mark, for it was just before Passover, about six weeks before the fully-formed fig appears. The fact that Mark adds these words shows that he knew what he was talking about. When the fig leaves appear about the end of March, they are accompanied by a crop of small knobs, called taqsh by the Arabs, a sort of fore-runner of the real figs. These taqsh are eaten by peasants and others when hungry. They drop off before the real fig is formed. But if the leaves appear unaccompanied by taqsh, there will be no figs that year. So it was evident to our Lord, when He turned aside to see if there were any of these taqsh on the fig-tree to assuage His hunger for the time being, that the absence of the taqsh meant that there would be no figs when the time of figs came. For all its fair foliage, it was a fruitless and a hopeless tree.”

Jesus discovered that the fig tree had no fruit on it and cursed the tree saying, “May no fruit ever come from you again!” Undeniably a fig tree is used symbolically to represent Israel in the Scriptures. Jesus was effectively denouncing Israel’s worship of God. With the cursing of the fig tree, He was symbolically denouncing Israel as a nation and, even denouncing all unfruitful “Jews ” (that is, people who profess to be godly but have no evidence of a relationship with Christ). The presence of a fruitful fig tree was considered to be a symbol of blessing and prosperity for the nation of Israel. Likewise, the absence or death of a fig tree symbolizes God’s judgment and rejection.

Micah 6:16You have observed the statutes of Omri and all the practices of Ahab’s house; you have followed their traditions. Therefore I will give you over to ruin and your people to derision; you will bear the scorn of the nations.

Jeremiah 26:6 then I will make this house like Shiloh and this city a curse among all the nations of the earth

2 Chronicles 29:8 Therefore, the anger of the LORD has fallen on Judah and Jerusalem; he has made them an object of dread and horror and scorn, as you can see with your own eyes.

Isaiah 65:15: You will leave your name for my chosen ones to use in their curses; the Sovereign LORD will put you to death, but to his servants he will give another name.

Jeremiah 44: 21″As for the smoking sacrifices that you burned in the cities of Judah and in the streets of Jerusalem, you and your forefathers, your kings and your princes, and the people of the land, did not the LORD remember them and did not all this come into His mind? 22″So the LORD was no longer able to endure it, because of the evil of your deeds, because of the abominations which you have committed; thus your land has become a ruin, an object of horror and a curse, without an inhabitant, as it is this day. 23″Because you have burned sacrifices and have sinned against the LORD and not obeyed the voice of the LORD or walked in His law, His statutes or His testimonies, therefore this calamity has befallen you, as it has this day.”…

“I will take away their harvest, declares the LORD. There will be no grapes on the vine. There will be no figs on the tree, AND THEIR LEAVES WILL WITHER. What I have given them will be taken from them.’” Jeremiah 8:13

Acts 7:48-49, “Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet, HEAVEN IS MY THRONE, AND EARTH IS MY FOOTSTOOL: WHAT HOUSE WILL YE BUILD ME? SAITH THE LORD: OR WHAT IS THE PLACE OF MY REST?”

The Sin Of Worshiping The Land Of Israel Instead is Idolatry, as idolizing and worshiping of Jerusalem, Israel and the Jews is evil in the sight of God. Especially since Israel today is a shameful nation that has abandoned the sole God of the Bible, Jesus Christ. It is demonism that are inspiring people to idolize Israel and the Jews. You are now also God, Bible IGNORANT if you do still think that God blesses any Christians who support a wicked, Christ-rejecting people, Nation of Israel. The land of Israel itself and the nation still has nothing to do with our salvation from death and sin.! Jesus alone now died, was buried and rose up three days later for our justification. Defending Israel is NOT even a man’s job. Defending Israel is NOT a function of the New Testament Church. In fact, this may come as a shock to you, but the Bible says that Jerusalem and the Jews will be attacked and defeated, continually as we often hear about it too, until the Lord returns to earth, thus ending “the times of the Gentiles.” Luke 21:24, “And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.” Israel today is not the fulfillment of any New Testament Biblical prophecy. as well.Only a total jackass, fool would believe otherwise.. Don’t be fooled as God is not concerned with restoring Israel to the Holy Land anymore . Jesus told the Jewish rabbis of His time that the kingdom of God had been taken away from them forever. Zionism itself now still has no need, purpose, nor concern for the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Salvation is of the Lord. Salvation came through the Jews, not by the Jews. A Jew must be born-again or he or she cannot go to Heaven. Nicodemus was a Jewish leader, a Pharisee. Jesus warned Nicodemus that he needed to be born again or else he couldn’t enter into the kingdom of God (John 3:5-7). Hebrews 13:5 promises that God never forsakes His own. If you are unsaved, do refuse to accept Jesus Christ as th Lord of your life, it is you alone that have already forsaken God and rather now next Hell, the Lake of Fire will be your eternal home. https://jesussayscome.wordpress.com/2015/02/15/hell-is-real/

Christians alone are God’s Chosen People, and Christians are His Holy Nation. Now all who are Christ’s Chosen are the “people of God” and are “precious” in His sight, whether they be Jew or Gentile, German, African, Asian, Latino, Arab, English, or Italian. The Apostle Peter wisely addressed these matters. In I Peter 2: 4-6, we read that Christians—not Jews as a race—are “chosen of God and precious.” Peter instructed Christians:

“…ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people… Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God.”

“Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear: for our God is a consuming fire.”; (Hebrews 12:28-29);

“‘All power in heaven and on earth is given to me. So go and make followers of all people in the world. Baptize them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. Teach them to obey everything that I have taught you, and I will be with you always, even until the end of this age.’” —Matthew 28:18-20 NCV

Comparative religion’s values

While there are some common, rare similarity amongst some of the major religions in this world, The aspect of polygamy, the rigths of divorce is clearly one that contrasts them all.. for a True Christian divorce is not permitted at all.. even if many Christians falsely practice it.

Too Many persons do practice their own version of Christianity, and Islam it seems thus, based on what others have said it says too..

It is true that there are many Muslims, men as well as women, who fully do not live up to the teachings of Islam,and the other religions now just as there are too many Christian men and women who do not live up to the teachings of Jesus, the Apostles, the Bible undeniably.

Muslims women themselves now often complain to news editors how they are abused by Muslim men. Muslim Relgion and do not have equal rights to the men, for example the right to go to school in many Muslim countries now too.. Muslims have equal rights to the other citizens in the English speaking countries.. In fact non Muslims do not have the same rights as Muslims in many Muslim countries now too and all of these facts are undeniable, and undisputable.

You must always still judge any person now by what they say, but by what they do. Bad people do bad things, no matter what their religion is now too.

Also real Reform from within Muslim societies is still even needed, first by even education, knowing that over half of Muslims today, are illiterate, only 15 percent do even know Arabic, which is the language of the Qur’an, the holy book of Islam.

One cannot help but notice how so many of these religions differ but now they still do claim to be originated with God. A true God is certainly not so confused that he has started all these various, different and false religions.

Afghani journalism student Parwiz Kambakhsh has been sentenced to death for blaspheming because he not only downloaded articles regarding woman’s right’s under Islam, but also exposing the brutality against women and children by the local warlords in his community. He is being sentenced to death for “disseminating defamatory comments about Islam.”Say it isn’t soooo? Sounds like another mo-ham-med teddy bear moment to me! A three judge panel decided that his articles were blasphemous and sentenced him to die. That’s Shari’ah Law for you. The issue for this writer is the Islamic concept of blasphemy

For any religion to survive in the modern world, it needs to adapt to its reality, especially when it comes to equality between men and women concerning religious practices. As men and women should worship God in the same way, women should also have the same rights as women in assuming religious responsibilities.
Some persons try to say that Islam has freed them, but did your brothers, father, government free you yet too? or are they still killng, murdering you ?

http://gto7.wordpress.com/2008/02/03/islam-is-truly-satans-religion/

Physical abuse, Human rights abuses, Verbal abuse, silent treatment or being a control freak is also not acceptable even on the net..

Seven reasons why I believe in the resurrection of Jesus Christ

The resurrection of Jesus Christ is the basis of Christianity. The Apostle Paul stated that if Christ had not been raised from the dead, than all preaching and all teaching of God’s Word would be useless and so would the Christian faith. For this reason, I would like to review seven reasons why I fully believe in the resurrection of Jesus Christ.1. The historical reality of Jesus Christ is true.
The historicity of Jesus Christ is airtight. We have over 5,000 first century documents pointing to Jesus. The secular Roman historian Josephus mentions Jesus in his first century writings. There is archaeological confirmation, especially in the last 30 years, that verify the historical figures mentioned in the New Testament.

2. The character of Jesus Christ is unquestioned.
Jesus questions the authorities by asking, “Can any of you prove me guilty of sin?” (John 8:46) None of them could prove him guilty – even after painstakingly questioning and investigating him.

3. The works of Jesus Christ went unchallenged.
The works of Christ, especially his miracles, were never disputed by his foes. The religious authorities acknowledged the miracles of Jesus and even made claims that Jesus powers came from the devil.

4. The identity of Jesus was confirmed.
Jesus claimed who he was by saying, “I am the way and the truth and the life.” (John 14:6) God, the Father proclaimed, “This is my Son, whom I love. Listen to him!” (Mark 9:7) The Apostle Peter said, “You are the Christ”. Even the authorities knew of Jesus’ claim to be God. Granted, these all came from the Bible. However, the most compelling proof is that Jesus the Messiah fulfilled over 700 prophecies of the Old Testament.

5. The death of Jesus was undisputed.
He did not pretend to be dead. The grisly details are recorded of his resurrection, including the fact that a spear was thrust into his side and the Romans did not have to break his legs.

6. The burial of Jesus was public and secure.
He was placed in the tomb of a prominent Jew. The huge stone was set in place and sealed. Roman guards were posted and if they had truly “slept” through the stealing of Jesus’ body, they would have been executed. Besides, would this fearful band of disciples have the nerve to overcome the guards or sneak in to steal the body?

7. The evidence for Jesus’ resurrection is convincing.
The resurrection was predicted by Old Testament prophets. Jesus predicted his death and resurrection several times to his disciples. He appeared over twelve times to over 500 people over a period of forty days. He appeared to Saul, the great persecutor of the early Christians, and his life was transformed. The transformation of Peter from cowering in front of the accusations of a little girl to boldly proclaiming Christ in public and in front of the religious authorities is amazing.

The fact remains that Christians don’t have to throw their brains in the trash can to say that Jesus died and rose again. When you put the evidence in court and the witnesses on the stand, the truth points very solidly in favor of Jesus. What is proclaimed in the Bible is true.

So, what does this mean for us today?

1. The resurrection of Jesus Christ validates the claim that he is the way, the truth and the life.

2. It gives absolute hope for the future. Jesus tells us, “Because I live, you also will live.” (John 14:19) He also says, “In my Father’s house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am.” (John 14:2-3)

3. It offers spiritual life right now. By faith, we receive Christ and the power of the Holy Spirit. Our lives our transformed and we are given peace.

You are the jury. You are given the opportunity to accept or reject the evidence. Your response will determine your destiny.

There are certainly skeptics in the world whose goal is to refute the resurrection itself or even the existence of Christ. Even though there is enough evidence strong enough for a truly objective person to consider the truth as stated in God’s Word. So, then why do people still stubbornly reject Jesus’ claim?

We are given a clue in John 3:19. “This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because there deeds were evil.” People reject the truths of the gospel because they love the darkness. The Light of Christ exposes our life. It reveals the fact that we are full of pride and self-centeredness. Our sinful nature exalts our self over a God. The Light tells us to turn from darkness (our self, our pride) and turn to Christ. We turn because we realize that we have a need we can’t possibly fill on our own – not because Christians don’t have good answers to difficult questions.

For all those who are reading this post and have not accepted Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, I ask you to come to the Light and receive Christ. For those who already believe, stay strong and do not be afraid or timid to share the truth. Remember, Jesus told us, “I am with you to the very end of the age.”

These thoughts were taken from an excellent series entitled, “Why I Believe” by Chip Ingram.

Seven reasons why I believe in the resurrection of Jesus Christ

Do also see

http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/08/01/sikhism-is-an-independent-religion-and-it-is-not-a-sect-of-islam-or-hinduism/

http://abdoukili.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/religious-inequality/

http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/06/22/as-to-what-is-a-christian/

http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/07/17/the-false-divorce-incentives/

http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/07/01/marriage/

http://groups.msn.com/Jesussayscome

http://pbulow.tripod.com

http://groups.msn.com/HolySpiritCome

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by thenonconformer on August 2, 2008 • Permalink

Posted in Christianity, NEWS & POLITICS

Tagged Alliance, Arabs, Bible, Brethren, Canada, Christ, Christian, Christianity, Church, Churches, Comparative Relgions, Conservatives, Daystar, Dispensationalists, Divorce, Elders, Evangelicals, Faith, false, Focus on the Family, fundamentals, Gentile, God, Hindu, India, Islam, Israel, Jesus, Jews, Judaism, Liberals, Life, Muslims, News, pastor, Pastors, Pentecostals, Politics, Reformed, Relgion, religion, Sikh, true

Posted by thenonconformer on August 2, 2008

https://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/08/02/comparative-religions-values/

Sikhism is an independent religion and it is not a sect of Islam or Hinduism

Many people think that Sikhism is a sect of Islam or Hinduism and many others think that Sikhism is a combination of Islam and Hinduism even because it seems whenever white people or any other person from any race looks at their turbans and dasthaaraa, pugaa and dhumala’s they think they are simply Muslims because they have a Turban and others think we are Hindus because of THE FACT OF GURU NANAK DEV JI CAME FROM A HINDU FAMILY. Well they are basically unrelated. Sikhism clearly differs a lot from them as well especailly in women’s rigths.

What really do Sikhs themselves now say about their relgion?

Supposedly God sent Guru Nanak Dev Ji to the this world in order to enlighten Hindus and Muslims that they are merely fighting with each other trying to prove that their religion is superior. Guru Nanak Dev Ji preached that one does not have to be in a certain religion to meet God. It does not matter which religion one belongs to, as long as one performs true worship and meditation, he or she is capable of meeting with God. As proclaimed by God, Guru Nanak Dev Ji introduced a true immaculate way in order to attain salvation and be one with God. Whoever followed the way of Guru Nanak Dev Ji was known as Sikh. Many Hindus and Muslims joined Guru Nanak Dev Ji and became his follower. Sikhism is an independent way to meet God, which does not derive any ritual from either Hinduism or Islam, however there are some similarities in the rituals and beliefs which are clarified below. Sikhism is an individual faith established by God through Sikh Gurus and it is completely wrong to consider Sikhism as a part or combination of either Hinduism or Islam.

Guru Nanak considers himself neither Hindu nor Muslim. He did not follow Hindu rituals and nor did he join Islamic law. As commanded by God, Guru Nanak introduced a true faith, whose sole purpose is the love towards God. Guru Nanak Dev Ji denounced the superstitions followed by Hindu and Muslims and told them to worship God instead of considering their religion superior.

Many Hindus and Muslims consider their religion superior but Guru Nanak Dev Ji instructed to focus on meditation of God instead of glorifying a religion. Bhai Gurdas narrates one instance when Hindus and Muslims asked Guru Nanak about was greater among them. “Priest from both Hinduism and Islam got together and began discussing religion. A great fantasy has been created and no one could understand its mystery. They asked Guru Nanak to open and search in his scripture whether Hindu is great or the Muslim. Guru replied that, without good deeds both will have to weep and wail. Only by being a Hindu or a Muslim one cannot get accepted in the kingdom of God. As the color of safflower is impermanent and is washed away in water, likewise the colors of religiosity are also temporary.” (Bhai Gurdas Ji’s Vaars 1). Guru Nanak Himself said, “The Hindu comes to the house of a Hindu. By reading the scriptures, he puts on the sacred thread. He puts on the thread, but does evil deeds. Not by taking baths he will be approved in the Kingdom of God. The Muslim glorifies his own faith. Without following the Guru, he will not be accepted in the Kingdom of God. Only a few people follow even if they are shown the way” (Guru Granth Sahib, 951).

Following are the reasons how Sikhism is different from both Hinduism and Islam:

1. Hindus worship Demi-Gods like Shiva, Bramhma, Krishna, Vishnu, Kali, Durga, Ganesh and others. Sikhism instructs to believe in One Almighty God. “The performance of countless millions of other devotions is not even equal to one devotion to the Name of God” (Guru Granth Sahib, 1163). [ More … ]

2. Hindus perform idol worship. Sikhism instructs not to perform idol worship and not to worship anyone else besides God. Guru Granth Sahib Ji is Sikhs’ Holy Scripture. Sikhs bow their head in the Gurdwara to Guru Granth Sahib as a sign of respect but Sikhs do not worship the scriptures. Guru Ji is the spiritual teacher of Sikhs and shows the way to meet God. Guru Nanak instructs that idol worship will not lead one to salvation. [ More … ]

3. Hindus practice caste system. Hindu society is divided into four basic caste clusters. People are ranked according to their caste and are considered either superior or inferior. Sikhism instructs to consider all humans equal regardless of caste, color, race, class and gender. [ More … ]

4. Muslims believe in polygamy and they even marry their cousins. By Islamic law Muslims can have up to four wives. Guru Nanak Dev Ji completely denounced these activities and instructed to be wedded to one person only.

5. Muslims indulge in animal sacrifices and Guru Nanak told them that this would not bring any good. Killing God’s creations in the Name of God is totally ironic. [ More … ]

6. Muslims do not give women equal status. However, Sikhism instructs to give women equal status. [ More … ]

7. Muslims makes fast and consider the month of Ramadan holy. Sikhism instructs that making your body suffer will not help you to meet God. Sikhism tells that meditation of God is above all.

8. Both Hindus and Muslims cut their hair. Sikhs however do not cut their hair as a respect towards God and live the way God made us. [ More … ]

9. Both Hindus and Muslims consider their religion superior. Guru Nanak Dev Ji instructed to focus on meditation of God instead of glorifying a religion. To the Muslims Guru Nanak says, “The Muslims praise the Islamic law; they read and reflect upon it but God’s bound servants are those who bind themselves to see God” (Guru Granth Sahib, 465).

10. Both Hindus and Muslim make pilgrimages. Sikhism instructs to search for God inside your heart. One does not need to go to Pilgrimages in order to be close to God. In addition, Sikhism instructs that taking bath at pilgrimages do not wash sins. Bathing at Ganga, and Triveni does not clean your soul. The only way to clean your soul is to meditate on God. [ More … ]

11. Moreover, Sikhism instructs the purpose of life. The purpose of this life is to become one with God, to merge in the One whom we originated from. [ More … ]

12. Finally, Sikhism shows the way to attain salvation and become One with God. Sikhism says that you do not have to fast, abstain, go on renunciation or enter a monastery in order to meet God. All you have to do is have faith, recite the Name of God and remember Him for each possible moment. Guru Ji themselves got married and lived a family life and showed everyone that you can meet God while living a family life. Furthermore, Guru Ji said that your mind has to be detached from this world, you have to look this world as a temporary place, you will not be here forever, one day you will have to die. What you do while you are alive is critical, so make your decisions wisely. Furthermore, you do not have to detach yourself from this world physically, you can lead a normal family life and still be able to meet God. [ More … ]

Guru Nanak Dev Ji laid the foundation of Sikhism as instructed by God. The next nine Guru sent to this world by God, strengthened the roots of Sikhism and enlightened people to meditate on One God only. Many people found the true meaning of Sikhism and those who did join and embraced Sikhism with love. Sikhism tells everyone to get rid of egotism, anger, greed, and materialistic things. Sikhism tells everyone to live a humble life and worship God. God sees all and your worship will be fruitful with time.

It is completely ridiculous to consider Sikhism a sect of any other religion. Just like you wouldn’t consider Christianity a sect of Buddhism, you should not consider Sikhism a sect of either Islam or Hinduism or a combination of both.

http://www.realsikhism.com/faq/combination.html

What others say

“Islam as a religion aiming to oppress women is a direct result of the abuse of Islam by some Muslim states, depending on the absolute respect given to religion by Muslim societies. In fact, Islamic law, if interpreted outside of its proper context, could be abused to justify and codify the violations of women’s rights in Muslim societies and states in the name of religion, in order to achieve certain social and political goals. The central question that poses itself, is whether there already exists a space for women to enjoy their human rights under the umbrella of Islam, or whether in general, men “have a degree” over women in Islam (Abdul-Ati). If some people are arguing that Islam ensures equity between men and women in both rights and duties, then what does it mean when the Qur’an, which is the standard revelatory source of Islamic Law, says: “And women shall have rights similar to the rights against them, according to what is equitable; but men have a degree (of advantage in some cases of inheritance) over them,” (Qur’an 2:228). How would those people explain the meaning of that “degree” that men have over women? Is it because of that revelatory verse that some Muslim societies until now treat women as second-degree creatures in the name of Islam? The existence of some specific women’s rights in Islam is now obvious, and provided with a good argument, but how about polygamy in Islam? Is it true that a Muslim man has the right to marry up to four wives? Where is equity, then? What does it mean when the Qur’an states that a Muslim man, if he has the potential, can choose to marry one or two or three, or even four women (Badawi)? Does it mean that women are that marginalized and humiliated by the name of the religion?”

http://takingitglobal.org/express/panorama/article.html?ContentID=2393

It is a sad note as well that both religious persons of all the minor, major religions too, and non religious persons, at least 90 percent of them, have been, or are still unacceptably guilty of false the discriminations of others, even too often the accusers of the others.

There is still a serious, real need in changing the Muslim countries’ laws, agendas, in order to fill the gap between the supposed women’s rights afforded by Islam, and women’s rights afforded in reality by many of the Muslim societies, and most Muslim males have to accept some serious religious even re-education..

“My beloved wife oftentimes reminds my family to regard her with respect to her mind, but my mama and papa laugh at her. What can I say to my wife to stop her from slapping them down in anger? “. If husband can divorce his wife by saying 3 talak at a time & marriage is over, then how does Islam protect women’s right? Many husbands do abuse their divorce power. All the Muslim men who claim to be Muslims and abuse the women supposedly do not even know well their own religion or do not practice it? and for too many Muslim men it seems also it does not matter what Islam says because he is only following what pleases him, his interests, his interpreations of the laws.. sad.. Also since Islam came supposedly with higher moral laws to correct those of the Jahiliyyah, why didn’t Islam abolish enslaving women and children at times of war? Any abuse of anyone by anyone still is unacceptable. ” Everytime I ask my dad to open a bank account for me, he says I am a girl and therefore I should not get a bank account, while my younger brother has a bank account…” all about the true side of Islam.

“O ye who believe! Ye are forbidden to inherit women against their will. Nor should ye treat them with harshness, that ye may Take away part of the dower ye have given them,-except where they have been guilty of open lewdness; on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and equity. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and God brings about through it a great deal of good. Surah 4 Verse 19″

…They (Your wives) are your garments and ye are their garments. …. Surah 2 Verse 187

“Among the Muslims, the most perfect as regards his faith is the one whose character is most excellent, and the best among you are those who treat their wives well.”

While there are some common, rare similarity amongst some of the major religions in this world, The aspect of divorce is clearly one that contrasts them all.. for a True Christian divorce is not permitted at all.. even if many Christians falsely practice it.

It is true that there are many Muslims, men as well as women, who fully do not live up to the teachings of Islam, just as there are many Christian men and women who do not live up to the teachings of Jesus. You must always still judge any person now by what they say, but by what they do. Bad people do bad things, no matter what their religion is now too. Also real Reform from within Muslim societies is still even needed, first by education, knowing that over half of Muslims today, are illiterate, only 15 percent know Arabic, which is the language of the Qur’an, the holy book of Islam. Too Many persons do practice their own version of Christianity, and Islam it seems thus, wrongfully practise what others have said it says too..

Note: Sikhism now also like Mormons, Hindus, Jehovah Witnesses, Islam , Buddhism, and many others too are a cult, sect that bears no genuine relationship to Christianity too. It does not follow the Christian Bible too. One cannot help but notice how so many of these religions differ but now they still do claim to be originated with God. A true God is certainly not so confused that he has started all these various, different and false religions.

Do also see

http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/06/22/as-to-what-is-a-christian/

http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/07/17/the-false-divorce-incentives/

http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/07/01/marriage/

http://groups.msn.com/Jesussayscome

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by thenonconformer on August 1, 2008 • Permalink

Posted in Religious discussions Christianity

Tagged Christianity, Hindu, India, Islam, Judaism, Life, Muslims, religion, Sikh

Posted by thenonconformer on August 1, 2008

https://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/08/01/sikhism-is-an-independent-religion-and-it-is-not-a-sect-of-islam-or-hinduism/

the posts the Lakeland Revival bashers seem to despise

Florida Healing Outpouring with Todd Bentley: 30 Reasons for Healing (16-30)

27 06 2008

First, Roy Fields is back! Others leading has been moving, but there is something about him that changes the atmosphere. Roy, welcome back. Second if you are in Lakeland Fl on the 4th of July there will be free food. From 4-7pm, next Friday there be a celebration with free food. This will also lead into a water Baptism service. I am just thrilled for both of these events. The first shows a desire to reach out to host community and give back to those who have given so much. As important, the second is another example of how Fresh Fire and Ignited are taking care and shepherding those who are making profession of faith under their leadership.

Another fun fact, there is now a medical doctor who is reviewing all the medical reports about healing. The desire for accountability and integrity is great in Lakeland. One of the assistants said there is a four step process for those who take the stage professing healing
1 Pastor volunteers from around the world, screen and test, those who claim to have received healing
2 This is then relayed to those who bring the person on stage, to ensure what is shared is consistent
3 After they are on the platform, a survey is filled out with symptoms, sign of healing and contacts.
4 FOLLOW UP! 1-2 weeks a phone call is made to see how they are doing.

Just some random quotes form Todd Bentley… he really does use the name of Jesus.
(This is just a sample, to show who the glory goes to)

“We are encouraging people to see doctors after healings. I believe in medicine”
“It is the power of Jesus. We are powerless without the power of the Holy Ghost
“Can we give thanks to Jesus for this.”
“We want to give all we can, leally, to the media to give the glory to Jesus.”
“We give all the glory to Jesus”
“Can we give Jesus all the glory tonight?”
while praying for healing, “Two new ankles in Jesus mighty name”

30 Reasons for Healings #16-30 (all verses NIV)

16. He does what he pleases – God is sovereign and healing happens because God chooses too.
17. Charitable Giving- (whole chapters but verses) Acts 9: 36 In Joppa there was a disciple named Tabitha (which, when translated, is Dorcas), who was always doing good and helping the poor and Acts10:2 He and all his family were devout and God-fearing; he gave generously to those in need and prayed to God regularly. Based on these verses miracles happens as a direct result of charitable giving. It would seem that when we take care of the pour, God reaches and extra measure of the miracles.
18. The Gospel – Mark 16:19-20 He and all his family were devout and God-fearing; he gave generously to those in need and prayed to God regularly. Healing is good news and, according to Todd, the Gospel is the power of God as well as the message of salvation
19. I am a friend of God’s – John 15:15 I no longer call you servants, because a servant does not know his master’s business. Instead, I have called you friends, for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you. God hears the prayers of His friends. What do you do for your “true” friends? The deeper the intimacy with God, the deeper the friendship. Is God your friend, because there seems to be many who understand Jehovah but do not understand Abba. Abba, is the characteristic of a deep personal relationship.
20. The Glory of God – John 11:4 When he heard this, Jesus said, “This sickness will not end in death. No, it is for God’s glory so that God’s Son may be glorified through it.”
21. The cures of the Law – Romans 8:2 because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death. Healings show that you free from the law of sin and death.
22. Desperation: Mark 5:27 When she heard about Jesus, she came up behind him in the crowd and touched his cloak, Sometime people need a touch so bad they push trough to get it. “if only this small amount” They are the ones who are desperate enough to reach out and get healed

23. Connection locked up

24. Name of God – Exodus 15:26 He said, “If you listen carefully to the voice of the LORD your God and do what is right in his eyes, if you pay attention to his commands and keep all his decrees, I will not bring on you any of the diseases I brought on the Egyptians, for I am the LORD, who heals you.”

25. Communion – 1 Corinthians 11:29-30 For anyone who eats and drinks without recognizing the body of the Lord eats and drinks judgment on himself. 30That is why many among you are weak and sick, and a number of you have fallen asleep. This would seem to be a reason why you are not, but if it bring sickness maybe it bring healing (my thought on it, time was short so the last were real quick)

26. Gift of the Spirit- There was no verse give to justify this, but 1 Corinthians12:9-109to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit, 10to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues,[a] and to still another the interpretation of tongues.

27. The name of Jesus – Triune God, Jesus is God see #24

28. The nature of the Holy Spirit – God creates when the Holy Spirit the Holy Spirit moves. It was after Genesis 1:2 Now the earth was [a] formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. That God said, “Let there be light.” IF the Spirit lives with us, then he is moving, we should expect creation (new body parts is creation).
29. I am Saved – James 5:15 And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise him up. If he has sinned, he will be forgiven. Faith is a gift of the Spirit and only saved people have this. So salvation, brings faith, faith brings healing. And, yes because Jesus forgave my sins.
30. Kingdom of God- Mathew 6:10 Your kingdom come, your will be done on earth as it is in heaven. There is no sickness in the Kingdom, God preformes creation in His kingdom, there are miricals in the Kingdom, let it be so here

These are the second half of the 30 reasons, each with scripture refrances. People you may not like Todd Bentley, but please be careful arguing against the word of God. For those around Todd, let him know I said “thanks for the teaching, it has meant a lot to me.”

On a personal note: I blew out my knee today, while walking down some stairs. It hurt to move or even put pressure on it. Tonight, during the broadcast, I WAS HEALED. Proof of this, I wrote this whole blog standing up.

http://allenwilson.wordpress.com/2008/06/27/florida-healing-outpouring-with-todd-bentley-30-reasons-for-healing-16-30/

the Lakeland critics seem to be led by the devil..

Beware always of men and women, bullies, tormentors, control freaks, persons, civil and public servants, politicians, pastors, leaders, elders, who falsely do, will try to enslave you, oppress you, exploit you even while they claim they are proclaiming the truth, democracy, trying to help you, etc.,

Is 51:23 ..your tormentors {and} oppressors, those who said to you, Bow down, that we may ride {or} tread over you; and you have made your back like the ground and like the street for them to pass over.

http://postedat.wordpress.com/

Do see also

http://pbulow.tripod.com/

http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2008/07/21/hidden-agendas/

http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/07/21/the-pretender-imposter-wolf-in-sheep-clothing/

http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/07/07/control-freaks/

http://www.socyberty.com/Advice/Are-You-a-Control-Freak.101788

http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/wrongful-accusations/

http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/verbal-abuse-is-always-unacceptable-too/

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by thenonconformer on July 25, 2008 • Permalink

Posted in Religious discussions Christianity

Tagged Abortion, Amish, AOG, Apocrypha, Assemblies of God, Assemby of God, Baptist, Baptists, Bashing, Benny Hinn, Bentley, Bible, Bible Study, biblical, Born Again, Brethren, Bully, Catholic, Catholics, charismatic, Charles Stanley, Christian, Christianity, Church Fathers, COG, Compulsive, crucify, Daystar, Deacon, demonic, demons, direct enemy, distorted, divination, doctrine, doctrines, Early Christian Writings, El, El Oheim, El Shaddai, elder, Elias, Elijah, Elisha, eloheim, enjoying everyday life, Episcopal, episcopalian, Evangelcials, Evangelical, false accusations, false attacks, false opponents, false pride, false suppositions, family, family values, Father’s House, fellowship, Forgiving Yourself, G-d, gethesemene, God, good news, gospel, gospels, great physican, G_d, Hallelujah, handmaidens, handmaidens magazine, hannukah, Hanukah, Healing, health, health care, heaven, hebrew, hidden agendas, His, His workings, Holy, Holy Spirit, hope, Horn of Salvation, hosannah, Humble, humility, In touch ministries, indicative, instructing, inter denominational, interdemoninational, internal peace, Israel, Israeli, jehovah, jehovah witness, Jehovah’s witnesses, Jerry Sevelle, Jesus, Jesus Christ, jew, jewish, johannan, John, joy, Joyce Meyer, Joyce Meyers, Judah, Judaism, judeaism, Ken Copeland, Kim Clement, kindness, king, kingdom, Kingdom of God, lack of humility, lack of love, Lakeland, last days, Latter Rain, lies, living stones, lord, love, luke, Lutheran, lying, mark, matthew, meekness, Mennonite, Message of Salvation, Messiah, Methodist, Ministry, New Testament, non-denominational, nondenominational, Obsessive, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder Disorder, OCD, one sided bashings, Passover, patience, peace, pentacost, Pentacostal, pentecost, pentecostal, petra, petros, poor associates, pope, praise, pray, prayer, Presbyterian, Prophecy, prophet, Protestant, Quench, rapture, reborn, Reform, Reformed, Relgious discussions Christianity, religion, religious, Religious Spirits, renewal, resurrection, return of Christ, Revival, rock of ages, Salvation, Satan, Satan Or demons, saviour, seriously, seventh day, sky angel, soul, southern Baptist, southern gospel, speaking in tongues, Spirit, spiritual bondage, straw arguments, streaming faith, TBN, The Father’s House, the God channel, the last days, the potters house, the rapture, The Rock, their ignorance of God, This is your day, Todd Bentley, tree of life, Trinity, truth, truths, unBiblical, unleavened bread, witchcraft, Worship, worship center, worshipping, Yeshua, yom kippor

Posted by thenonconformer on July 25, 2008

https://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/07/25/the-posts-the-lakeland-revival-bashers-seem-to-despise/

TOO OFTEN FALSE BASH OF PENTACOSTALS HEALERS

Mark 16:17 And these attesting signs will accompany those who believe: in My name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new languages;
Mark 16:18 They will pick up serpents; and [even] if they drink anything deadly, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will get well.
Mark 16:19 So then the Lord Jesus, after He had spoken to them, was taken up into heaven and He sat down at the right hand of God.
Mark 16:20 And they went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord kept working with them and confirming the message by the attesting signs {and} miracles that closely accompanied [it]. Amen (so be it).

In contrast I read on the net what the bullies, bashers say about healings, miracles.

http://hiscrivener.wordpress.com/2008/06/28/faith-healers-could-encounter-a-setback-at-the-altar/
http://kimolsen.wordpress.com/2008/07/01/george-banovs-blasphemous-prophecy-at-todd-bentleys-ordination/

It should be clear to most of us, the bad guys do not like my pages still.. it shows them in their true light.. the bad guys, bullies, bashers or what ever?

THE WAY MANY FUNDAMENTAL EVANGELICAL AND SUPPOSEDLY PROFESSING CHRISTIAN CRITICS TRY TO MAKE FUN AT OTHER CHRISTIANS IS SICKENING, A VERY POOR THEOLOGY AND IS SADLY NOW ALSO TYPICAL OF THE MUCH TOO OFTEN FALSE BASHING OF THE PENTECOSTALS TOO! It clearly makes me think that Satan himself is behind most of it still too.

And what about the Phoney wars and phoney peace by the professing Christians now too..
http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/05/30/why-is-toronto-airport-christian-fellowship-angry-still/

As to bullies question to me.. ““are you ranting”… my how you still do like to bash, insult people.. you do not know them even well enough to falsely even try to judge them, your approach is quite immature and unspiritual too.. looking for a big fight cause someone had stepped on your sore toes.. http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/08/12/more-about-control-freaks/

I certainly hope you do not profess wrongfully to be a Christian to anyone, cause you do not act like it for sure… nor do I hope you abuse all the people like that who make a post here.. a sure way to next lose many people still too. Stay in God’s love and not rather in the flesh.. we may not agree, do have a right to differ, but we still do need to show love to the others. Need more input from me on the subject.. I have it detailed even on 5 internet sites.. ”

It is very clear that the much too many false Critics of the Pentecostals will try to grasp at any straws to falsely bash the Pentecostal and still try to justify their own immoral acts..

Any Christian being plagued with critics, opponents, unsubstantiated personal attacks too now, is really nothing new even to the past apostles, prophets , Jesus Christ himself who have face many similar bullies, groups etc., the devil is too ready an accuser of the Brethren, and tries to continually discredit any work of God even since the time of Jesus Christ himself now too even using inapplicable and distorted Biblical reasons and Bible verses now too.

I also would not take any criticism even seriously by persons who admittedly even admit they are opposed to all charismatic’s gifts, speaking in tongues included, and the persons who do not acknowledge even themselves now having never received a clear, specific baptism of the Holy Spirit firstly, and also especially when also they themselves have not attended these meetings, or the meetings any of of the latter rain churches..

A MAJORITY OF THE CRITICS OF THE LATTER DAY REVIVALS, are too clearly their now too often diverting back wrongfully the topic discussions, and themslves making often personal insulting, unacceptable derogatory remarks and even their evidently their typical unChristlike bullying Reponses, self righteous, a superiority attitude, and what else? is not the right approach from anyone and it does continue to reflect poorly on ALL OF THEM STILL too…

THE WAY THEY THEMSELVES DO UNDENIABLY POINT FINGERS AT THEIR SELF DEFINED OPPONENTS, IN A JUDGMENTAL MANNER, UNLOVING, UNKIND, UNJUSTIFIABLE MANNER IS CLEARLY THE MORE IMPORTANT ISSUE NOW TOO. And very revealing what they are firstly like themselves
http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/06/23/understanding-me-and-others-better/

“I have read in the last month every wordpress site, and many others sites openly bashing, abusing, slandering the Florida revival, Todd, the latter day Pentecostals and yet to date I personally have not read, seen one valid criticism, decent presentation at all.. what a great shocker.. It all seems more like little immature, jealous kids still fighting over which one of them will be the greatest in the kingdom of heaven and who will be last.. what a real absurdity. I myself though have opposed Todd Bentley’s associated with some really bad pastors, trying to make money form selling items at the revival.. and his false application for divorce..

Hey Critics, Don’t get desperate but get real… like I have rightfully said I also would not take any criticism even seriously by persons who admittedly even admit they are opposed to all charismatic’s gifts, speaking in tongues included, and the persons who do not acknowledge even themselves now having never received a clear, specific baptism of the Holy Spirit firstly, and also especially when also they themselves have not attended these meetings, or the meetings of any of the latter rain churches..

I did not say Charismatic supposedly churches.. cause we know those often mean rather the Catholic Pentecostals..

as to what the Bible says is only how you here do interpret it.. not the Holy Spirit.

I have been a Christian for 50 years and a Pentecostal pastor for the last 30 years, and I have attended the latter day churches too and often.. and specifically what about you? not the supposed others..

The Latter Rain movement was rejected by the AOG Pentecostals in 1948 as heretical… and what they are speaking for God now.. dream on.. There are other pentecostal persons, denominations who support them, approve of them, me included. The AOG has it’s own falsehoods, and problems it needs to look at.. (Mat 7:3 KJV) And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

The Full Gospel Business Men’s fellowship uses a similar latter rain approach for decades now too.
http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/07/05/laying-of-hands-impartation-breathe-of-the-spirit-anointings-anointed/

Too many persons are bashing other Pentecostals with clearly a hidden agenda, jealousy, and it is still the wrong thing to do so now too.. they are not even doing it in love or humility Cleary as required by the Bible now too. ”

Even because Evangelical Fundamentalism, dispensationalists, too often also replaces the worship of God , the Holy Spirit, Jesus Christ   with the sole worship of the Bible, bypassing the works of the Holy Spirit it seems, though most Fundamentalists will deny that. Liberalism, too, replaces the worship of God, and of the Holy Spirit, Jesus Christ   with the worship of something else. In the case of Liberalism, however, the worship of God was replaced by the worship of mere human reason , and both groups are not that far apart, for they are are in error.

Fundamentalists worship every word and letter in the Bible. Actually, they worship their own private re-interpretation of scripture (compare 2 Peter 1:20). This is the same error that the Pharisees fell into. They ended up worshiping Torah more than God, and, even more than Torah, they worshiped their own interpretations (and the interpretations of the elders) of Torah. (They still do so today, only now they have codified those traditions into the Talmud.) Likewise, so do Fundamentalists worship their own interpretation of Scripture. In both cases, “they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever.” (Romans 1:25).

Fundamentalists and Liberals too need to learn the truth of 2 Corinthians 3:6, “Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.” They need to seek God in SPIRIT and in Truth. Liberals need to learn the truth of John 4:23 (quoted above) and of John 6:63, “The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.” They need to seek God in Spirit and in TRUTH.   http://jmm.aaa.net.au/articles/12941.htm

hard to tell the difference

Reality! These days it is too hard to tell the difference between secular persons and even evangelical pastors, elders, deacons too for they all seem to do the same bad things too.. adultery, alcoholism, gossip, slander, divorce..

And when I see shallow arguments of anyone still limiting today as to what God today can do, even through us, EVEN ABOUT HEALING, it makes me rightfully also think how shallow their Christian faith now really is.. they are still babies in the Lord and need someone to teach them the whole truth, the whole , full gospel too, for my God can do anything, Jesus is the same , yesterday, today and forever.

ON TOP OF THAT I CANNOT BELIEVE HOW SO MANY OF THESE SAME PERSONS PERSONS ALSO FALSELY RISE TO DEFEND SMOKING, WINE, ALCOHOL AS WELL AND WORK FULLY TO DENY IT IS SINFUL.. “Spurgeon was once asked when he would quit smoking cigars. He replied, “When it becomes a problem.” He was then asked, “When will it become a problem?” To which he replied, “When I smoke two at a time.” AND look at all the false justifications for Spurgeon’s sin.. and do see also alcoholism the unacceptable sin

When you talk about what the scriptures says you honestly should also point out that you mean it is how you now interpret what the scripture says.. cause too many of us read different things out of the same scriptures as we all do know firstly..

The people who also tell us to use only the Bible often still lie further to us.. they ask us also to use men’s commentaries, instead of the Holy spirit to next interpret the Bible.

(Eph 4:18 KJV) Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

I tend to look at both sides of the issues myself.. for that matter I have now been both non Christian, and Christian, both Baptist and Pentecostal, and both groups still do have major errors, weakness, inadequacies, and they now also have some good points too.. but still there is no such thing as a perfect denomination now as well

But one other thing often is clearly is evident to me visiting, reading the many so called Professing Christians sites mostly all telling us the supposed truth, postings often more with dishonest hidden agendas, poorly researched too, very biased now too.. It also seems to me they are also still are trying to convince themselves as to what is the truth is and no one else, they build up their own false straw arguments, and then do reply to their own arguments. It is generally too often now not an honest presentation, discussion of the topic they have presented. http://slaughteringthesheep.wordpress.com/2008/07/01/todd-bentley-gets-annointed-by-special-oil-from-africa/

>>Pastors are going there by the droves. I know one personally. He went to Toronto to bring some of “it” back and he’s done the same thing with Lakeland. I think he thinks this will be the answer to filling the seats in his church, “http://christiantheology.wordpress.com/2008/06/30/depart-from-me-i-never-knew-you/

Did he really tell you that or are you in truth distorting, lying, falsely judging him and many others cause you are a controling person ?
I see nothing wrong in going there and I am real Christian now too

The nonconformer replied “I never knew you, is not a criticism by Jesus that the healings, miracles done by the person(s) were false.. but a true statement that they really never knew Jesus fully or personally, it seems to apply to you now firstly too. For no pastor, evangelist, healer IS PERFECT TO START OFF..

You are so sensitive to others being supposedly false, cause you clearly are false, now take the beam out of your own eye first.. Someone is wrong here and I don’t think it is that difficult (except perhaps for you) to determine who that is and that is you.. for you do twist Bible verses, slander, falsely quickly bash others to suit your own views..

Clearly Judas was an Apostle, better look at the definition of an Apostle, an Apostle is not an unchristian person.. and he was next replaced in the book of acts by another Apostle. The fact that Jesus knew that Judas would betray him does not mean he was not anointed.. but first better look at the meaning of the word anointed now.. one who evidences the Holy spirit.. with signs and wonders Acts 10:38

If you do not let the Holy spirit lead you as to what a verse actually means you are part of the Blind leading the blind now, forget trying to say the scripture cannot be wrong, rather you are wrong.. “You throw the term free will around as if it does not need to be defined. ” and yet you clearly in desperation rebuttal quoted back a verse that has nothing to do with one’s free will.

“You have contradicted now three times the Word of Jesus,” and what a further false and wrong, judgmental act on your part too, you so easily condemn a person whom you do not know, never met, another real Christian, a real Christian now over 50 years too, and I have been pastoring now for over 3 decades as a Pentecostal pastor too. So get a real life. Really do get Jesus.”

Why is it so many people try too limit the power of God, and they work so hard to try to tell us what God can and cannot do today.. for sure, definitely it is not only cause they are spiritually immature, have a hidden agenda, are promoting themselves, or they are unoriginal parrots who repeat what others have said , but it is often still mainly because Satan for sure is behind all this too.
http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/07/04/discern-it/
Evangelical fundamental parrots often need to quote someone else cause they do not know the Holy spIrit well enough to let him lead them, even the truth about healing. I SPEAK FOR MYSELF. http://pbulow.tripod.com/healing.html
http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/05/25/64/
Is 45:5 I am the Lord, and there is no one else; there is no God besides Me. I will gird {and} arm you, though you have not known Me,

(Jer 32:27 KJV) Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all flesh: is there any thing too hard for me?

Beware always of men and women, bullies, tormentors, control freaks, persons, civil and public servants, politicians, pastors, leaders, elders, who falsely do, will try to enslave you, oppress you, exploit you even while they claim they are proclaiming the truth, democracy, trying to help you, etc.,

Is 51:23 ..your tormentors {and} oppressors, those who said to you, Bow down, that we may ride {or} tread over you; and you have made your back like the ground and like the street for them to pass over.

I undeniably could not help but notice on even the web too how supposedly British religious clergies, scholars, Christians, falsely also do bash American Pentecostal revivals? It is not being done out of jealousy too?

http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/08/22/it-is-not-good-for-the-man-to-dwell-alone/

I have been on the net for over 2 decades, and I have thousands of readers regularly reading my posts. Hey I too have often said that there are many professing bashers, bullies, liars now even on the Christian internet and they think they alone can make the rules, enforce the rules on others, and that is too bad for them too for they need to grow up.. and to firstly get used to the right of free speech of others, other’s right to be heard and to male their own posts .. I only have about 30 internet sites written often for these bad hypocritical Christians now too so hopefully they too will learn the truth about themselves.. too bad guys do not like me to use my right of free speech.. so what else is new.. they by their bullying, control freak approach clearly show to all what hypocritical Christians they rather are! They are not humble servants of Jesus for sure.

8 Comments

by thenonconformer on July 25, 2008 • Permalink

Posted in Religious discussions Christianity

Tagged Abomination, Abortion, Amish, AOG, Apocrypha, Apologetics, apostasy, Arminianism, Assemblies of God, Assemby of God, Baptist, Baptists, Benny Hinn, Bible, biblical, Biblical Interpretation, blasphemy, Brethren, Catholic, Catholics, charismatic, Charles Stanley, Christian, christian values, Christianity, Church Fathers, Compromise, Compulsive, crucify, Daystar, Deacon, demonic, demons, direct enemy, distorted, divination, doctrines, Dove Awards, Early Christian Writings, El, El Oheim, El Shaddai, elder, Elias, Elijah, Elisha, eloheim, End Times, enjoying everyday life, Episcopal, episcopalian, Evangelical, false accusations, false attacks, False Doctrine, false opponents, false pride, false prophet, false prophets, false suppositions, family, family values, Father’s House, fellowship, Forgiving Yourself, G-d, gethesemene, Gnostics, God, good news, gospel, gospels, great physican, G_d, Hallelujah, handmaidens, handmaidens magazine, hannukah, Hanukah, haunted, Healing, health, health care, hear, heaven, hebrew, heresy, hidden agendas, His workings, Holy, Holy Spirit, hope, Horn of Salvation, hosannah, Humble, humility, In touch ministries, indicative, instructing, inter denominational, interdemoninational, internal peace, Israel, Israeli, Jakes, jehovah, jehovah witness, Jehovah’s witnesses, Jerry Sevelle, Jesse Duplantus, Jesus, Jesus Christ, jew, jewish, johannan, John, john adonai, John Calvin, joy, Joyce Meyer, Joyce Meyers, juanita, Judah, Judaism, judeaism, Ken Copeland, Kim Clement, kindness, king, kingdom, Kingdom of God, lack of humility, lack of love, Lakeland Florida, last days, Latter Rain, leveitation, listen, living stones, lord, love, luke, Lutheran, mark, Mark Chironna, matthew, meekness, Mennonite, Message of Salvation, Messiah, Methodist, Ministry, Mysticism, New Testament, non-denominational, nondenominational, Obsessive, occult, occultism, one sided bashings, Passover, Pastors, patience, peace, pentacost, Pentacostal, pentecost, pentecostal, petra, petros, poor associates, pope, praise, pray, prayer, Presbyterian, Prophecy, prophet, Protestant, Protestantism, Quench, rapture, reborn, Reform, Reformation theology, Reformed, Reformed Theology, Relgious discussions Christianity, religion, religious, Religious Spirits, renewal, resurrection, return of Christ, Revival, rock of ages, Satan, saviour, seriously, seventh day, Signs of the Times, sky angel, soul, southern Baptist, southern gospel, speaking in tongues, Spirit, spiritual bondage, Strange Fire, straw arguments, streaming faith, TBN, TD Jakes, The Father’s House, the God channel, the last days, the potters house, the rapture, The Rock, their ignorance of God, This is your day, Todd Bentley, tree of life, tres deis, Trinity, truth, unBiblical, unleavened bread, wait, Westminster Confession, witchcraft, Wolf, Word of Faith., Worship, worship center, worshipping, Yeshua, yom kippor

Posted by thenonconformer on July 25, 2008

https://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/07/25/too-often-false-bash-of-pentacostals-healers/

Jews and their own need of Salvation by Jesus Christ still too

(Acts 4:10 KJV) Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

(Acts 17:31 KJV) Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

Like the Jews at the time of Jesus Christ here on earth too most people do not understand, do not want to admit the truth as to what realy happens to anyone after they do die here on earth.

The only truth for now and forever is that Jesus Christ is the sole way of salvation, there is no other way, name by which any man, Jew or gentile can be now or in the future saved by. No other way to escape Hell..

Now why does any person still falsely think or teach that 144,000 horsemen will come back for the Chosen race (the Jews) before the 2nd coming of Christ? Firstly they fail wrongfully to admit that Jews are no longer the chosen race, they the jews in God’s will, kingdom, reign have all now been replaced by the Christians, the Christians now are the chosen ones.

(Heb 9:27 KJV) And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

The Bible says it is appointed for all men once to die and after that an immiedate, final judgement, they all next only go to heaven or hell immediately upon death based on what they, anyone did with Jesus Christ here on earth, accepted or rejected him, and there is no other path for one’s personal salvation, there no purgatory as well for any Jew or non Jew too. And now there is nothing Biblical in what anyone can as about the Jews positive future. Jesus is the only way of salvation for all. And these false Jewish oriented hopers, dreamers, teachers have still a a complete false assumption that the Bible next says that God will save all of the Jews or restablish the Jewish nation for this will never occur. Theirs is even the the same error that Apostle Judas had made That is why so many Jews next here on earth will be deceived by the antichrist, he will tell them the lies they want to hear.

Any persons falsely expecting a resurrected nation of Israel, a continuation of the Jewish religion, a totally Jewish controlled, dominated world next will be disspaointed for in reality any and all of the Jews positive present, future are now all actually dead as far as the Bible,and God are now concerned, and now and forever too. They the Jews will never be resurrected again to be a nation, a group or what ever under God’s will.

It is tragic, sad that too many people still cannot accept that truth, undeniable fact, that the Jews already had their chance to become Christians, they all had mostly rejected it, and so next it is the end of them as being anything of value, purpose in God’s sight, end..

(Rom 10:1 KJV) Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. 2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

(Rom 1:20 KJV) For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: 21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, (Rom 8:5 KJV) For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

(Rom 8:14 KJV) For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

(Rom 9:7 KJV) Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called 8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

(Rom 9:32 KJV) Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

(Rom 16:18 KJV) For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

But some people do still still try to grasp at non existent straws to bring back and save all or most of the Jews even at a later date.. These sad people their hope, views, beliefs are just as wrong, a false expectation as anyone expecting another chance for anyone, someone to get saved in Heaven next for a persons who has already died unsaved.

Look it at it’s simplicity, once there were the Jews as God’s chosen, now, next there are only the Christians, they are the chosen ones, and not the Jews In the future some more Jewish person will be saved and become Christians, but only a small remnant.. And then it is the end of the world. Jesus comes for all people, Christians included and not Christians and they will get what they had personally sowed and immediately. Heaven to be with Jesus, hell to be away from Jesus….

(1 Pet 4:17 KJV) For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? 18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

(Heb 9:28 KJV) So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

Both Jews and Christians now by faith in Jesus Christ (Acts 3:25 KJV) Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.

(Rom 4:3 KJV) For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

(Rom 4:9 KJV) Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.

(Rom 4:12 KJV) And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

(Rom 4:13 KJV) For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.

(Rom 4:16 KJV) Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,

(Gal 3:7 KJV) Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.

(Gal 3:8 KJV) And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

(Gal 3:9 KJV) So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.

(Gal 3:14 KJV) That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

(Gal 3:16 KJV) Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Both Jews and Arabs, are physically from the seed of Abraham so does that make all of Arabs now a Jew also? No for to be a true Jew means to follow a religion, that your great great great grand mother and father both followed.. Being born a Jew and not following the Jewish relgion did not make you truly a Jew..

But next we do know that perverts, Bible ignorant persons, liars want to play on these words and say we are all children of God, or we are all Jews, or whatever.. but in reality we all even Jews, are or were children of the devil, of the seed of th devil because Adam and Eve our great great great grand mother and father both had sinned..but Christians became next solleyof the seed of Jesus Christ.. yet becuase Jesus was born a Jew that did not make us all of Christians next Jews now too.. for it does not matter who your father was, without Jesus Christ you will be in hell still .

As the Bible says Abraham foresaw Jesus Christ and he believed in Him.. if you do not beleive in Jesus Christ and no matter who you are, even a Jew, you will go to Hell.. there are on earth only Christians and non Christains, and only Christians in Heaven. All Non Christians go to hell.

(Mat 1:1 KJV) The book of the generation of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.

(Mat 1:17 KJV) So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David until the carrying away into Babylon are fourteen generations; and from the carrying away into Babylon unto Christ are fourteen generations.

(Mat 3:9 KJV) And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.

(Mat 8:11 KJV) And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.

(Luke 3:8 KJV) Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, and begin not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, That God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.

(Luke 13:16 KJV) And ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan hath bound, lo, these eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the sabbath day?

(Luke 13:28 KJV) There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.

(Luke 16:23 KJV) And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

(Luke 19:9 KJV) And Jesus said unto him, This day is salvation come to this house, forsomuch as he also is a son of Abraham.

(John 8:53 KJV) Art thou greater than our father Abraham, which is dead? and the prophets are dead: whom makest thou thyself?

(John 8:56 KJV) Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.

(John 8:58 KJV) Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

as for the Jews

(Acts 3:13 KJV) The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go. so they the Jews chose to go to hell

now as to the seeds.. plural or is the seed singular.. ..

And not 2 seeds spirtually.. but yes he had 2 seeds physically.. Jews and Arabs if you beleive in Jesus Christ then Abraham is your examplary spiritual father of faith.. still Abraham is the son of Godm Jesus Christ like all Christians are too..

All Israel Shall Be Saved?

by Steve Wohlberg

Romans 11:26 says, “And so all Israel will be saved.” What does this mean?

Obviously, it doesn’t mean every Jew will be saved. In fact, the same chapter says God hopes to “save some of them” (vs. 14). Judas was a Jew, yet we know he will be lost for betraying Christ. Jesus called him, “the son of perdition” (John 17:12). Jesus told many Jews, “If you do not believe I am He [the Messiah], you will die in your sins” (John 8:24). Not every Jew believes in Jesus Christ, thus many will “die in their sins” and be lost.

Many Christians today interpret Romans 11:26 as applying to the end of the seven-year tribulation when Jesus appears in the clouds at His Second Coming. In other words, they don’t apply the verse to all Jews throughout history, but only to “all Jews” who are alive at the end. Supposedly, at the end of the tribulation, all remaining Jews in Israel will look up, see Christ coming in the clouds, realize He is the true Messiah, believe in Him, and thus “All Israel will be saved.”

This is a false teaching, as I will attempt to show.

First, the context of Romans 11 is not the Second Coming.
“There is no partiality with God” (Romans 2:5-11). It would be an act of partiality to save “all Jews” at the end, but not “all Jews” in history. The idea is, “When all final Jews see Christ coming in the clouds, then they will believe.” But this would give those final Jews a supposedly irresistible opportunity to believe in Jesus Christ which past Jews have not had. Nor would this be fair to “all Gentiles” living at the end. Why would God save all Jews at the end but not all Gentiles? All Gentiles will see Jesus coming just like all Jews.
When Christ finally appears in the clouds, IT’S TOO LATE TO BELIEVE IN HIM. Rev. 22:11,12 says that before He comes in the clouds, all decisions have already been made. Jesus said it will be like Noah’s day (Mat. 24:37-39). In Noah’s day the door of the ark closed before the flood came (Gen. 7:16). When the flood came, it was too late. To save all Jews AT THE SECOND COMING would be like saving all those outside the ark WHEN THE RAIN STARTED FALLING.
When Jesus comes in the clouds, this is the time of judgment upon ALL unbelievers who don’t know God nor obey the gospel (2 Thess. 1:7-10; Jude 14,15).

So what does this mean, “All Israel shall be saved”? First of all, Romans 9:6 says there are two Israels. one is an Israel according to the flesh (Romans 9:3,4) and the other is the Israel of God (Galatians 6:14-16). The Israel of God is composed of both Jews and Gentiles who believe in Jesus Christ (Gal. 3:29). Gentiles who believe are grafted in. They become part of the “same body” with believing Jews (Eph. 3:6). Paul calls this unity of believing Jews and Gentiles, “the mystery of Christ” (Eph. 3:4).

The immediate context of Romans 11:26 is vs. 25. When “the fullness of the Gentiles has come in,” then “all Israel will be saved.” Or, to be exact, “And so all Israel will be saved.” In other words, the coming in of the fullness or total number of the Gentiles results in “all Israel” being saved. Paul’s idea seems to be that when all Gentiles (totally, throughout history) have come in, that is, have been grafted into the Vine, they, uniting with all Jews who have become believers, will form the total number of the saved. Paul also reveals that when Gentiles come in, God can use this to motivate some Jews to believe (verses 11 & 14). Vs. 25 calls this whole thing, “this mystery,” which we have already proven to be the “mystery” of both Jews and Gentiles being united in one body through Christ (Eph. 3:4,6). Vs. 27 says all are saved because Christ takes away their sins through His covenant, which must be the New Covenant, which applies to all believers, Jew and Gentile. Thus the “all Israel” that is saved is the total group of believing Gentiles and Jews combined.

The “all Israel that is saved” does not apply to all Jews throughout history, nor can it apply to a select favored group who become instant believers when Jesus Christ comes crashing down through the sky. By that time, it is too late to believe.

Now we all do really have freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom of speech, the right to be heard now as well.. I clearly do believe in the right of everyone to speak, to speak out as well, and to be equally heard by all, so we can all judge what has been said if it is appropriate and we can next corresponding act upon it, even in the church, in the government, on the internet now too. Clearly some bad people falsely still DO DISALLOW THIS RIGHT… the realy bad persons especially as even I know this for sure as they falsely refuse the whole to be shared even as as to who they are firstly. They respond with a personal attack, inquisition, censorship, lies, slanders, diversions, distortions, instead of facing, dealing with the facts, truths being presented. Confirming to many what they still are really like, liars, immoral, abusive bullies.

http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/09/18/what-does-the-word-chosen-mean-in-the-bible/

do see also

13 Comments

by thenonconformer on July 24, 2008 • Permalink

Posted in Religious discussions Christianity

Tagged Abortion, Amish, AOG, Apocrypha, Assemblies of God, Assemby of God, Baptist, Baptists, Benny Hinn, Bible, biblical, Brethren, Catholic, Catholics, charismatic, Charles Stanley, Christian, Christianity, Church Fathers, COG, Compulsive, crucify, Daystar, Deacon, demonic, demons, direct enemy, distorted, divination, doctrines, Dove Awards, Early Christian Writings, El, El Oheim, El Shaddai, elder, Elias, Elijah, Elisha, eloheim, enjoying everyday life, Episcopal, episcopalian, Evangelical, false accusations, false attacks, false opponents, false pride, false suppositions, family, family values, Father's House, fellowship, Forgiving Yourself, G-d, gethesemene, Gnostics, God, good news, gospel, gospels, great physican, Guilt & shame from sexual sins, G_d, Hallelujah, handmaidens, handmaidens magazine, hannukah, Hanukah, haunted, haunted house, Healing, health, health care, hear, heaven, hebrew, hidden agendas, His workings, Holy, Holy Spirit, hope, Horn of Salvation, hosannah, Humble, humility, In touch ministries, indicative, instructing, inter denominational, interdemoninational, internal peace, Israel, Israeli, Jakes, jehovah, jehovah witness, Jehovah's witnesses, Jerry Sevelle, Jesse Duplantus, Jesus, Jesus Christ, jew, jewish, johannan, John, john adonai, joy, Joyce Meyer, Joyce Meyers, juanita, Judah, Judaism, judeaism, Ken Copeland, Kim Clement, kindness, king, kingdom, Kingdom of God, lack of humility, lack of love, last days, Latter Rain, leveitation, listen, living stones, lord, love, luke, Lutheran, mark, Mark Chironna, matthew, meekness, Mennonite, Message of Salvation, Messiah, Methodist, Ministry, New Testament, non-denominational, nondenominational, Obsessive, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder Disorder, occult, occultism, OCD, one sided bashings, Passover, patience, peace, pentacost, Pentacostal, pentecost, pentecostal, petra, petros, poor associates, pope, praise, pray, prayer, Presbyterian, Prophecy, prophet, Protestant, Quench, rapture, reborn, Reform, Reformed, Relgious discussions Christianity, religion, religious, Religious Spirits, renewal, resurrection, return of Christ, Revival, rock of ages, Satan, Satan Or demons, saviour, seriously, seventh day, sky angel, soul, southern Baptist, southern gospel, speaking in tongues, Spirit, spiritual bondage, straw arguments, streaming faith, TBN, TD Jakes, The Father's House, the God channel, the last days, the potters house, the rapture, The Rock, their ignorance of God, This is your day, Todd Bentley, tree of life, tres deis, Trinity, truth, unBiblical, unleavened bread, wait, witchcraft, Worship, worship center, worshipping, Yeshua, yom kippor

Posted by thenonconformer on July 24, 2008

https://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/jews-and-their-own-need-of-salvation-by-jesus-christ-still-too/

thenonconformer

I am now retired, I live in Montreal, Quebec, Canada and I have a civil engineering degree, Concordia University , Montreal 1968, and I had worked as a Remax Realtor in Calgary too but in my decades of real life experiences in Canada the still too often unenforced existing laws, regulating societies, governments clearly did not stop too many bad Realtors, Lawyers, Pastors or even the cops now, Corporations too, Bell Sympatico from cheating, stealing, lying to the customers, others. It does not mean that have to accept it still too. I also have for a few years pastored a great home church, even I often did home and hospital visitations, marriage counseling, demons deliverance too. I have travelled across Canada and some parts of the US, also have been in many many different denominations, different Christian churches. Met many Pastors too. Kinda of experienced.

I also have no hidden agendas, I am not trying to get you to buy anything, I offer everything free, absolutely no money is asked for. There also is no church to join now as well, I merely try to tell the whole honest truth, positive and negative ones, even about politics, religion or what ever.

While I clearly do write on a wide range of topics including now politics, religion, family, still many readers have their own interests and these are the most popular words that they had lately used to access my wordpress sites-

Todd Bentley, Bell Sympatico problems, throttling, Pentecostal, Christian Missionary Alliance court, Assemblies of God Pentecostals, Bible versed wallpapers, Free Christian Books, Toronto airport church critiques, Messianic Judaism, Conservative in and out scheme location : Canada, Shit disease – C. diff , Silent treatment, Verbal abuses, Alcoholic home, Changing yourself, Fret not, Control freaks, Riches people in Calgary,

http://postedat.wordpress.com
http://anyonecare.wordpress.com
http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com
http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com

all of my Picasa Web Albums http://picasaweb.google.com/thenonconformer

(1 Cor 9:27 KJV) But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

an apostle facing the reality of being a castaway…

Sadly there is also an intellectual acceptance of the faith, even of Jesus Christ himself, but this is not the same now as accepting Jesus Christ as Lord.. believe on the lord Jesus Christ and you will be save.. I have often had business partner, friends, who supported the gospel, going to church, and yet refused to make a full personal commitment to God. Next when I had prayed about it to God he replied.. they have seen the kingdom from afar, but they are not going to go into.. so close and yet so far away still.

(Luke 14:31 KJV) Or what king, going to make war against another king, sitteth not down first, and consulteth whether he be able with ten thousand to meet him that cometh against him with twenty thousand? 32 Or else, while the other is yet a great way off, he sendeth an ambassage, and desireth conditions of peace.

Contrary to the devil’s and lawyers lies, only the lawyer’s and the courts are those persons who tend to get richer, profit generally from a divorce. On top of that Divorce persons tend to have a shorter life span, and a shorter life as well compared to the others.

A spouses also tends not to file for divorce unless certain conditions are met..

– The think they can get richer by a divorce.. but 2 can live cheaper than one..

– They have a substitute mate in mind, whom they should have consulted first, cause often they have no intention ever of marrying them too..

– The have the false support of their family, mother generally, brother and sister. Even often a false pastor, a false church now too.

– They have adequate cash at hand to pay for the initially lawyer’s fees. you would be surprised how many spouses still keep a hidden bank account from the other spouse, eventually the other spouse finds out and this causes really deep bitterness, anger, resentment, even unforgiveness too.

There’s no doubt there are abusive spouses, male and females.. but often one spouses provokes the other one into an abusive knowing beforehand as well.. http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/09/21/christians-cannot-marry-any-non-christians-or-get-divorced/

there are no real winners in broken home, a broken marriage generally now still too.”

Some Professing Christian persons have been contemplating and discussing what the proper attitude and conduct should be among Christians towards things like oppressed workers in China and things of that sort . Issues that pits left versus right, even!

The first essential Social action firstly as defined by the New Testament Books of acts in the appointment of deacons was, and still is the helping the poor and needy persons in the local Church. This was also true even in the old testament where 1/7 of the tithe was given to the local poor persons.

(Acts 6:1 KJV) And in those days, when the number of the disciples was multiplied, there arose a murmuring of the Grecians against the Hebrews, because their widows were neglected in the daily ministration (Gal 2:10 KJV) Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.

>>There is only one ‘expert’ on church planting and that’s the Lord, and Zech. 4:6 warns us that it is not by might or power (and not by man’s wisdom- 1 Cor. chaps. 1-2). God told us to start a church in August of 2003 with no funds, no supporting churches, etc.- i.e., nothing other than God’s leading. A missionary and experienced administrator talked with us, and told us we were violating ‘every rule in the book’ and that we were headed to be another one of the failed plants in our area (of which there have been many). We obeyed, and God blessed, and here we are as Calvary Chapel Space Coast ready to send our first full time missionary, and start another church campus. All by God’s grace, and all for His glory!

I ran a home church for about 2 dozen poor persons for years, and I fed them every week freely too, and I never asked ANYONE FOR MONEY, never took one offering too, God supplied all I needed too.

Secondly a true Christian Ministry starts as as a Faith Ministry, trusting in God to supply all of the needs and not rather being weak in the faith, starting a tax exempt and a marketing Corporation, even selling Books, tapes, video and things, begging, begging, begging OTHERS FOR MONEY.. with posts like like this.. ” I have incorporated as a nonprofit under the name “Athanatos Christian Ministries, Inc.” This is a pretty hefty step for me. It takes what has been a full time hobby and gives it legs to maybe be a full time full time endeavor into the future. Ultimately, the goal is for ACM to be self-sufficient, paying for itself off of book sales and products sold to churches, etc. At this time, however, donations are helpful. If that is of interests you, you may use the Paypal/credit card link on the ACM web page. I will still operate under the name of Sntjohnny especially in regards to my apologetics to nonChristians, etc. “

Some people who donate the money also do try to influence what can and cannot be preached too and do tie the hands of God here.

“I rightfully still do not endorse any Christians adds, anyone, any person, any organization, any Church now trying to make any money from the gospel, or begging, asking for money or even any of the adds here. I also do not endorse any of Bibles, books, tapes listed here for sale too. Jesus said as we have freely received so we are freely to give. Hirelings in their greed and visible lack of faith don’t do that. I do believe we should have the faith for God to supply what anyone needs freely to anyone who needs it. “Rev George Muellar did.”Note This site solicits no funds, or donations, or money what so ever.. ( nor does it sell any Christian supposedly literature, media) and it has no political, denominational affiliations, aspirations. Do use and Distribute all this material freely. http://pbulow.tripod.com/

The proper Christian Example- “No More Rich Seat/Poor Seat . George became the pastor of a small church in England. The church wanted to pay him a good salary from the money it received renting pews to rich church members who sat at the front of the church. (Poor members had to sit in the “cheap” seats in the back.) George told them that this had to stop if they wanted him to be their pastor. Even so, he did not allow the church to pay him a salary. He trusted God to meet his needs, and God did. George and his family never missed a meal and were always able to pay their rent. George began to sense, however, that God had something else for him to do.Praying Food into the Home. Each day as George walked the streets, he saw children everywhere who had no mom or dad. They lived on the streets or in state-run poorhouses, where they were treated badly. George felt God calling him to open an orphanage to take care of the children. George prayed, asking God to provide a building, people to oversee it, furniture, and money for food and clothing. God answered his prayers. The needs of the orphanage were met each day. Sometimes a wealthy person would send a large amount of money, or a child would give a small amount received as a gift or for doing chores. Many times food, supplies or money came at the last minute, but God always provided without George telling anyone about his needs. He just prayed and waited on God.. More than 10,000 children lived in the orphanage over the years. When each child became old enough to live on his own, George would pray with him and put a Bible in his right hand and a coin in his left. He explained to the young person that if he held onto what was in his right hand, God would always make sure there was something in his left hand as well.

More Bible verses Wallpapers sites.

Do you see any similarities between George Mueller’s and the Apostle Paul’s decisions to follow Jesus? How did George change after he became a follower of Jesus?

What did Mueller mean when he told the orphans to “hold onto the Bible in your right hand”?
Describe a time when God has answered your prayers and provided for you or your family.
4: Do you live by faith in God, to provide your needs, or do you rely on others, your job, your own efforts still? “

( Ironically many of his present supporters beg for money, sell his Books also to make money, instead of praying.) http://chi.gospelcom.net/kids/glimpsesforkids/gfk008_2.php

for more see http://www.bsmi.org/download/mueller/GeorgeMuellerOfBristol.pdf http://www.christiansintouch.com/greatMen_GM.cfm

http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/09/19/dispensationalists-it-seems-to-compensate-for-their-often-rejections/

“HOW TO ASCERTAIN THE WILL OF GOD

1. I seek at the beginning to get my heart into such a state that it has no will of its own in regard to a given matter. Nine-tenths of the trouble with people generally is just here. Nine-tenths of the difficulties are overcome when our hearts are ready to do the LORD’s will, whatever it may be. When one is truly in this state, it is usually but a little way to the knowledge of what His will is.
2. Having done this, I do not leave the result to feeling or simple impression. If so, I make myself liable to great delusions.
3. I seek the Will of the Spirit of God through, or in connection with, the Word of God. The Spirit and the Word must be combined. If I look to the Spirit alone without the Word, I lay myself open to great delusions also. If the Holy Ghost guides us at all, He will do it according to the Scriptures and never contrary to them.”

George Mueller 1805-1898 –from the classic biography of George Mueller, “George Müller of Bristol,” —New Window by A. T. Pierson —New Window, Appendix N: “The Wise Sayings of George Mueller“ —New Window

2 Comments

by thenonconformer on July 23, 2008 • Permalink

Posted in News and poltics, Religious discussions Christianity

Posted by thenonconformer on July 23, 2008

https://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/07/23/thenonconformer/

Messianic Judaism today

“The Ascendance of “Messianic Judaism” in the Context of “Hebrew Christianity” http://mcu.edu/papers/mess_jud.htm

A History of the 20th Century Movement in America of “Jewish Believers” in “Yeshua Ha Mashiach” (Jesus Christ) by William Greene, Ph.D.

The modern phenomenon of Jewish believers in Jesus Christ as their Messiah has a long history in the United States, and (as is the case with most modern Jewish history) has strong ties to a European heritage as well. Foundations for the twentieth century were laid, of course, in the nineteenth century and before; worldwide, estimates of Jewish conversions to Christianity approximated 250,000 during the 1800s, including such notables as British Prime Minister Disraeli, Old Testament commentary wri ters Franz Delitzsch and David Baron, and the first Anglican Bishop of Jerusalem, Michael Solomon Alexander.1 However, in America, this phenomenon has taken on some unique characteristics, the most prominent of which has been the evolution of what was known as "Hebrew Christianity" into today’s "Messianic Judaism." While some still try to maintain the existence of a present-day dichotomy between the two, for the most part, the latter has come to encompass the former.

This has not always been so. For many, the terms Messianic Jew and Hebrew Christian describe "different streams or ways of being a Jewish believer in Yeshua" (Hebrew for Jesus).2 Historian David Rausch emphatically believes that

at one end of the spectrum is Hebrew Christianity with a completely assimilated and church-acculturated Jewish convert to Christianity and on the other end of the spectrum is Messianic Judaism with the Jewish Christian maintaining traditional practice and either attending a Messianic congregation and/or a regular synagogue. To make this even more complex, there are Jewish believers in Jesus at various points along this spectrum who are using both terms ("H ebrew Christian" and "Messianic Jew") to describe themselves!3

For many within the movement, though (as discussed below), both terms are used, though Hebrew Christianity is often applied to the movement before the 1960s and 1970s. One anthropologist, Juliene Lipson, defined a Hebrew Christian as "a Jew who has accepted Christ as the Messiah and his savior, but who nonetheless chooses to retain his identity as a Jew." These Jewish believers are encouraged to join Christian churches in order to "avoid separating themselves from Gentile Christians," while at the same time, they are encouraged to join fellowships with other Hebrew Christians "to retain their ethnic identity and culture." 4 Others use the term as equivalent to Messianic Judaism, having "more in common with Orthodox Judaism than with the other two major forms [Conservative and Reform]. In fact [says this writer], ther e is more common ground between Hebrew Christianity and Orthodox Judaism than between the latter and Reform Judaism."5 The origins of this movement today can be said to have coincided with the period of the "national reawakening" of the Jewish people at the turn of the century.6

The early Hebrew Christians were mainly "fundamentalists" (the term comes from The Fundamentals , a series of books released from 1910-1915 in twelve volumes, detailing the absolute veracity of the Bible), who held a pro-Jewish and pro-Zionist position.7 In the late 1800s and early 1900s, there were several attempts at starting Hebrew Christian congregations, including in New York City in 1895, Toronto in 1917, Chicago in 1931, and Los Angeles in the 1930s.8 John Zacker, a Russian Jew, formed the Hebrew Christian Synagogue of Philadelphia, recognized as "the first distinct Jewish Christian house of worship in the United States;" it opened on February 25, 1922. 9

On May 22, 1901, the Boston Conference of the Messianic Council met, organized by Mark Levy, an English Jew, to push his idea to form an alliance in America of Jewish believers. This conference planned another conference to organize a Hebrew Christian Alliance of America (HCAA), which took place on July 28-30, 190310 (Louis Meyer, the corresponding secretary of this organizing conference, helped edit The Fundamentals ).11

Inaction followed this conference until 1913, when Maurice Ruben, a European-born Jewish businessman, held a meeting in Pittsburg with others (including Sabbati Rohold, an Orthodox Jew born in Palestine) to plan a conference, which established the HCAA in 1915. Rohold was elected its first President.12

The "driving motive" of the early HCAA was deemed to be evangelism, which was seen to fall "squarely on the shoulders of Hebrew Christians."13 In 1917, the HCAA began publishing the HCA Quarterly with a Yiddish supplement. It called its first full-time worker, Dr. Emmanuel Greenbaum;14 while the position of "worker-evangelist " had to be dropped in 1923,15 by 1932 missionaries were added once again.16 In 1923, the HCAA had established a "Chair of Jewish Studies" at the Moody Bible Institute, held by Solomon Birnbaum 17 (a position held today by Dr. Louis Goldberg). 18

From the beginning, the HCAA wished to be involved in the Zionist cause in Palestine. Though rejected by the Jewish Congress and the American Zionist Organization, they sent two workers to Palestine in 1920. In 1933, the International Hebrew Christian Association (IHCA) bought land to establish a colony near Gaza, but the contract was eventually broken, and they were not reimbursed until 1942.19 The IHCA had been formed in 1925 and headquartered in London. By 1935, it had affiliated alliances in approximately twenty countries (today, there are thirteen natonal Alliances affiliated with the IHCA). 20

In the 1920s, the HCAA took part in the fight against rising anti-Semitism, with records showing their strong denunciation of Henry Ford’s distribution of the forged Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion . 21 In the 1930s, the HCAA protested the treatment of Jews in Nazi Germany, especially calling attention to the plight of the one and three-quarter million Christians of Jewish descent, who were "all treated as Jews while the Jews of Germany consider[ed] the m Christians." They therefore had trouble finding relief in either camp.22 The HCAA helped many of them to relocate, and continued to aid victims of the Holocaust after World War II (especially in Hungary, where a large mission was established).23

One outcome of the growing anti-Semitism, which even existed in churches in countries such as Germany, was a growing interest in establishing separate Hebrew Christian congragations, as a counteractive force.24 In 1934, the First Hebrew Christian Church was established under Presbyterians in Chicago. It had a Christian worship service with a Jewish "flavor," and was headed by David Bronstein (later, under the leadership of Daniel Juster in the 1970s, the name was changed to Adat Ha Tikveh and made more "messianic").25 This did not mean, however, that Hebrew Christians were moving in the direction of modern Messianic Judaism (the establishment of a totally separate identity for Jewish believers); in fact, back in 1917, the HCAA had taken a strong stand against such a m ovement, and had promised "that the Alliance stand on this issue would never change… ‘to be absolutely free from it, now and forever’ .’" 26 The HCAA was to remain a fellowship of Jewish believers, who nevertheless maintained their ties to Christian churches.

The HCAA continued to remain somewhat active in the next few decades after World War II. It ran "Haven of Grace," a home for elderly Jewish Christians, from 1953-1966.27 A zenith was reached with the "World Congress of Hebrew Christians," held in 1955 during the Jewish High Holy Days, and considered at the time to be "the largest gathering of Jewish believers in the history of the movement."28 Branches continued to be formed around the country (one formed in Miami in 1957);29 however, progress was slow (and often non-existent), to the extent that B.Z. Sobel in 1974 characterized the Hebrew Christian movement as possessing "an overwhelming bleakness, enervating ambivalence, and negativity."30

Things were beginning to change, though. The 1960s had arrived, and the younger generation was beginning to assert itself. Many wanted to explore more of their Jewish heritage and practices. Within the movement as a whole, as Rausch explains,

there had always been two attitudes toward Jewish practice. The mainstream of the movement believed that any return to Jewish practices would put one under the Law. This was interpreted as something Christians should never do — even Jewish Christians … Nevertheless, ( rightfully or wrongfully too) a smaller group within Hebrew Christianity asserted that the Jewish believer had a right to maintain his Jewish heritage and identity.31

In 1966, under the auspices of the HCAA, the Young Hebrew Christian Youth Organization (YHCYO) was begun; in 1967, it became the Young Hebrew Christian Alliance (YHCA). It held its first separate conference in 1970 at Messiah College in Pennsylvania (in 1975, the YHCA was renamed the Young Messianic Jewish Alliance of America [YMJA]), and began to surpass the parent organization in membership and enthusiasm.32 Many of today’s leaders of the Messianic Jewi sh movement have come from the YHCA, energized by the "Jesus movement" of the late 1960s and early 1970s.33 An obvious "generation gap" grew between the older "denominational" Hebrew Christians and these younger "Messianic Jews." The upcoming generation wanted to change the styles of worship and evangelism to a more Jewish context. It was also at this time that "Jews for Jesus" (discussed below) began.

Martin Chernoff became the President of the HCAA (1971-1975), and led the group towards Messianic Judaism34 (his sons, Joel and David, also served as Presidents – 1979-1983 and 1983-1987, respectively).35 In June of 1973, a motion was made to change the name of the HCAA to the Messianic Jewish Alliance of America (MJAA); however, a two-thirds majority vote was necessary to effect the name change, and only 62% was received at this time. Two years later, though, there was enough support, and in June of 1975, the name was officially changed to the MJAA. 36 The (mostly young) supporters of Messianic Judaism had won out; the name change was significant as more than just a "semantical expression;" as Rausch states, "it represented an evolution in the thought processes and religious and philosophical outlook toward a more fervent expression of Jewish identity."37

It is this "fervent expression of Jewish identity" that truly sets the Messianic Jew apart. By definition, he or she is "a person who was born Jewish or converted to Judaism, who is a ‘genuine believer’ in Yeshua [Jesus], and who acknowledges his Jewishness."38 As Paul Liberman asserts:
A tenet of Messianic Judaism asserts that when a Jew accepts a Jewish Messiah, born in a Jewish land, who was foretold by Jewish prophets in the Jewish Scriptures, such a Jew does not become a Gentile. In fact, he becomes a completed Jew — a Jew who believes Jesus is the Messiah.39

In this context, there is then no conflict whatsoever between being "Messianic" and being "Jewish," since "believing in Yeshua, the Jewish Messiah, is one of the most Jewish things a Jew can do."40 The belief is held that this is Judaism in the "true" sense. In the words of Messianic Jewish theologian David Stern, "I am religious. Not Orthodox, not Conservative, not Reform, not Reconstructionist but Messianic."41

A key aspect of Messianic Judaism’s deviance from the former Hebrew Christianity is its emphasis on using original Hebrew terms in place of traditional (Gentile) Christian terms. Examples include Abba (God the Father), HaBen (God the Son), Yeshua HaMash iach (Jesus Christ), Ruach HaKodesh (Holy Spirit), B’rit Hadasha (New Testament), Mikveh (baptism), Joachim (John), Miriam (Mary), Sa’aul (Paul), and Shilush (Trinity).42

The term "Messianic Judaism," though some have traced it even to the nineteenth century, was propounded in the 1950s by Dr. Lawrence Duff-Forbes, but was not widely accepted at the time.43 The revival of the concept really began in the late 1960s, and came to fruition in the early 1970s. The early twentieth century works of its proponents within Hebrew Christianity (such as Zacker, Levy and others) had little impact on its present-day com eback and growth, as their works were not even rediscovered until the 1980s, well after the entrenchment of today’s Messianic movement.44

The leading organization of this movement is still the MJAA (the former HCAA), being the largest of its kind in the world, and representing the estimated 100,000 Messianic Jews in the United States. It is part of the larger international alliance formed in 1925, and encompassing thirteen countries.45 The MJAA is headquarted in Philadelphia (having moved there in 1980 from the old HCAA headquarters in Chicago,46 which had been located there since 1942). 47 For some years, the MJAA followed the practices of the HCAA and established local branches in various cities. However, these branches gradually began to go out of existence as a new phenomenon grew: Messianic congregations and synagogues. 48

In 1975, there were only seven of these distinctively Jewish congregations; 49 a decade ago, there were only fifteen. Today, there are at least ten times that number across the country.50 Martin Chernoff founded the first successful present-day Messianic Jewish congregation in Cincinnati, Ohio in 1970; 51 other examples include Congregation B’nai Maccabim in Chicago, led by John Fischer,52 the Messianic Jewish Congregation in Minneapolis (headed by Norman Nelson, a Gentile),53 Ahavat Zion Synagogue in Encino, California,54 and the most influential congregation in the MJAA from 1978 onward, Congregation Beth Yeshua in Philadelphia (also led by Martin Chernoff).55 Even Miami has at least three: Beth Yeshua, Beth Messiah in Miami Beach, and Bet Hesed in Kendall.

Over ninety percent of the Messianic congregations in the United States are "charismatic" in their theological orientation (believing in the gifts [charisms] of the Holy Spirit: tongues, healing, etc.),56 with one-third having been created by the charismatic Assemblies of God denomination.57 The meeting halls themselves often look similar to other synagogues, with the Israeli flag and the American flag at the front on either side, a Star of David, a menorah, and (in some cases) a Torah scroll behind a curtain. 58 Interestingly enough, these congregations are not "overtly evangelistic." They see their purpose as being for fellowship and worship "in a fashion more conducive to the Jewish heritage" than would be the case in a traditional Gentile Christian setting. 59

There are four umbrella organizations available for these congregations: the International Alliance of Messianic Congregations and Synagogues (IAMCS, a charismatic outgrowth of the MJAA), the Union of Messianic Jewish Congregations (UMJC, an independent charismatic group formed while the MJAA was hesitant in forming the IAMCS), the (non-charismatic) Fellowship of Messianic Congregations, and a smaller grouping within the Assemblies of God denomination.60

The UMJC, currently based in Denver,61 was formed in June of 1979 by thirty-three congregational leaders from the U.S. and Canada. It was not designed to be a hierarchical control mechanism, but instead "as a loose confederation to aid in fellowship and education." Beginning with only nine c harter members, the number had risen to twenty-five by 1982.62 In 1986, the IAMCS was formed by the MJAA, and is much more structured than the UMJC, granting only associate membership until a minimum number of congregants is reached and other standards are adhered to. 63

Several Messianic yeshivas have been founded,64 including Betzel Shaddai in Chicago, started by John Fischer (who also founded B’rit Shalom in 1978, which functions as an educational service agency to Messianic congregations). 65 In addition, there is the MJAA’s Institute for Messianic Rabbinic Training (IMRT). Formed in 1989, the IMRT is designed to lead candidates to ordination, and offers Associate’s and Bachelor’s degrees in Messianic Rabbinics.66 Many of its courses are offered at the Annual Conferences of the MJAA, held at Messiah College in Grantham, Pennsylvania, which attracts approximately 2000 attendees.67 Over the years, conference participants have come to the Annual Conference from many countries, including Argentina, Australia, Brazil, Denmark, England, Finland, France, Germany, Hungary, Ireland, Israel, Mexico, New Zealand, Russia, South Africa, Sweden, and most of the United States.68

If the Messianic congregations are not "overtly evangelistic," there is a Jewish Christian organization that is: Jews for Jesus (JFJ). Founded in California by Moishe Rosen, the name (which is often misapplied to Jewish Christians in general, much to the chagrin of many of them) originated with a San Francisco Hillel rabbi who used the term in a campus newspaper article to describe the "Jewish Jesus People" he saw . Liking the "ring" of it, "Moishe enthusiastically appropriated the phrase for his group as both name and slogan."69

His "group" had started as a mission of the North Carolina-based American Board of Missions to the Jews (ABMJ),70 who sent Rosen (an ordained Baptist minister) to California in the early 1970s. He was so successful that they brought him back to New York to train other Jewish evangelists, but eventually he returned to San Francisco, populating JFJ mostly with born-again hippies (Jewish and Gentile).71 In August 1973, the ABMJ terminated Rosen’s position as he became less denomination-oriented and more Jewish-oriented (messianic); the other eleven members of the mission also resigned from the Board in order to stay with JFJ. Their primary focus at this point had to be on raising financial support, since ABMJ funds had been cut off. This support came mostly from churches, so JFJ toned down their youth culture image, presented more and more of a Jewish image, and developed a "Hebrew Christian" ethnic identity.72 Today, JFJ is supported by churches, a number of Bible schools, and individual Christian donations (they take money only from those who agree with their beliefs; other donations are returned). In 1987, their annual budget was approximately $7 million, with ownership of $4.5 million in property and equipment.73 Today, their budget runs $10.2 million, with a full-time staff of 150 employees running branch offices in nine cities across the United States. There are also branch offices in Toronto, London, Paris, Buenos Aires, and Johannesburg. 74

JFJ’s tactics are headstrong (sometimes confrontational) and evangelistic in nature; they are most famous for their "campaigns," during which they go out on the streets of major cities such as New York and distribute millions of "broadsides" (folded-over humorous tracts presenting the gospel in a Jewish manner). They also work in airports; in 1987, they won a unanimous Supreme Court decision protecting their First Amendment rights to distribute literature in government-run airports (the case was argued for JFJ by Jay Sekulow, who now heads the American Center for Law and Justice [ACLJ] in Virginia Beach, Virginia).75

Jewish Christians, whether labeled Hebrew Christians or Messianic Jews, have encountered much opposition over the years, from both Jews and Christians. Most Hebrew Christians themselves were at first opposed to their following Jewish customs and laws.76 Reaction to the growth of Messianic Judaism has been strong from some Jewish missionary groups, as well. The Chicago-based American Messianic Fellowship (AMF), established by the Christian Zionist W.E. Blackstone in 1887, called the movement "utterly unscriptural," stating its belief that "while still a Jew by birth, in spiritual condition the believing Jew is now a Christian and totally removed from the religion of Judaism."77 In 1975, the Fellowship of Christian Testimonies to the Jews (FCTJ) officially opposed Messianic Judaism as a "fourth branch of Judaism, and as distinct from mainline Christianity."78 Across the spectrum of Christianity, some evangelicals opposed the "Jewishness" of Messianic Judaism, while some mainline Protestants opposed the tactics of "Jews for Jesus"-style evangelism.79

Of course, Jews have opposed the movement as well. At the beginning of this century, the majority of Jews did not accept Jewish believers as being sincere; a common belief was that anyone who became a believer "must either be deranged or have converted for material gain."80 When the HCAA asked to become involved in the Zionist cause in Palestine, they were rejected by the Jewish Congress and the American Zionist Organization. 81 The American Jewish Committee has for years attempted to alert Jews to the "dangers" of Messianic Judaism; 82 and the Union of American Hebrew Congregations (UAHC) has established a Committee on Cults and Missionaries, which provides educational materials "for use by member congregations in the battle against the deceptive techniques of … various Hebrew-Christian groups."83 Other groups, such as Jews for Judaism and the Jewish Defense League (JDL), have (sometimes violently) opposed and protested against Messianic Judaism and Messianic congregations.84

Is the Messianic Jew an "absurd Jew?" As Rausch puts it, "The Christian has told the Messianic Jew that ‘Judaizing’ is a very grave sin. Jews have told the Messianic Jew that the idolatry of ‘Jesus’ is a very grave sin."85 The movement would seem to be stuck between the two. However, their strength, as shown previously, has grown exponentially. Where they were dismissed a few years ago, they are today taken seriously (whether in a positive light or not). In fact, in a large number of cases, by the 1980s, many of the organizations which had been "anti-Messianic" were now mostly supporting "the concept of Messianic congregations and distinctly Jewish forms of worship and religious practice."86 And many in the movement now reject outright the attempt to divide Hebrew Christians and Messianic Jews as distinct and separate categories.87 In an article on the movement in Reform Judaism , Sheri Gordon writes:

There are more than 450 groups that hope to convert Jews in the United States, Israel, and Canada. Of those, approximately 150 are Hebrew Christian organizations, such as Jews for Jesus, that practice a hybrid of Judaism and Christianity. In 1978, approximately 10,000 Jews belonged to a Hebrew Christian group; today the ranks have multiplied to 160,000 members … Missionizing to Jews also extends to television shows such as "Zola Levitt" in Dallas and the "Jewish Voice Broadcast" in Phoenix and radio programs such as "Messianic Vision" in New Jersey. 88

If present trends continue, the Messianic movement in the United States will likely achieve more success in the coming years. However, while its acceptance may grow among Gentile Christians, there is little likelihood that the same acceptance will be granted by the American Jewish community. Thus, Messianic Jews will probably remain on the outside of this community, looking in. “……

Having a religion will not help you if God himself is against you.

Jer 52:1 ZEDEKIAH WAS twenty-one years old when he began to reign, and he reigned eleven years in Jerusalem. And his mother’s name was Hamutal daughter of Jeremiah [not the prophet] of Libnah. Jer 52:2 And he did that which was evil in the sight of the Lord, according to all that Jehoiakim had done. Jer 52:10 And the king of Babylon slew the sons of Zedekiah before his eyes; he slew also all the princes of Judah at Riblah. Jer 52:11 Then he put out the eyes of Zedekiah; and the king of Babylon bound him with shackles and carried him to Babylon and put him in prison [mill] till the day of his death. Jer 52:12 Now in the fifth month, on the tenth day of the month, which was the nineteenth year of Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon, there came to Jerusalem Nebuzaradan captain of the guard, who stood {and} served before the king of Babylon. Jer 52:13 And he burned the house of the Lord and the king’s house and all the houses of Jerusalem; every great house he consumed with fire.

Lam 1:5 Her adversaries have become the head; her enemies prosper. For the Lord has afflicted her for the multitude of her transgressions; her young children have gone into captivity before the enemy.

Now the city of Jeruslamen sadly has twice been destroyed by Pagans and by fire in History..

It should be understood by all that all Jews still need to be saved from their sins, Hell itself by accepting Jesus Christ as their Personal lord, Savior, and any of their Jewish cultural roots will not save them.

(Mat 23:37 KJV) O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

(Mat 23:38 KJV) Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

(Mat 23:39 KJV) For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

http://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/04/29/israel/

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by thenonconformer on July 14, 2008 • Permalink

Posted in Christianity, NEWS & POLITICS, Politics, Religious discussions Christianity